Fw: Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Re: Documentary about Richard II

this one isn't showing as received..apologies if it becomes a double post.

--- On Tue, 8/28/12, fayre rose <fayreroze@...> wrote:


From: fayre rose <fayreroze@...>
Subject: Re: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
To:
Received: Tuesday, August 28, 2012, 12:08 PM







anne lived a life of status and priviledge until her father rebelled against e4. she then hit even higher status with the marriage to h6's son, the heir presumptive to the crown.
 
someone asked earlier why margaret took anne with her when edward was killed. it is very likely that margaret wanted to ensure that *if* anne was pregnant..that margaret would control the fate of the possible unborn child.
 
if a queen was widowed in that era, she was often locked up for a few of months after the date of the death of her husband the king. this was to ensure any issue born to the widowed queen was indeed the king's and not an unknown lover. the mother of an heir to the throne would weild great power. therefore it was necessary to ensure that the father was indeed the king. they didn't have paternity tests in those days.
 
but back to anne. i read recently that it is possible she and richard had more children than just edward. she may have suffered miscarriages and deaths of young children.
 
i'm reasonably sure i found the info at this website.
http://www.silverboar.org/news13.htm#3
 
see where it says news13..change the number up and down to access more of these newsletters. some are quite good and informative.
yes..it is the silverboar website.
http://www.silverboar.org/news9.htm#authenticity
the children of richard, is the title of the article.

--- On Tue, 8/28/12, EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@...> wrote:


From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@...>
Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
To:
Received: Tuesday, August 28, 2012, 10:05 AM



 



I think Anne was used as a prawn...sorry pawn...as a child regarding marriage. This was commonplace with 15th century noble families and nothing unusual there....In fact I guess the York brothers got off lightly with being able to choose their own brides...but hey look where this got Edward!
This of course does not make her a weak adult and possibly quite the reverse. I would have thought that the various ups and downs she had through her very early years made her a better person, kind and understanding of other peoples troubles. Once she had found her own feet..with her marriage.. I think she had a very good life up until tragedy struck with the death of her son. Eileen

--- In , Paul Trevor Bale <paul.bale@...> wrote:
>
> I found her style in 'Treason' a bit flowery and purple in places. I much preferred her follow up novel about Perkin Warbeck "The Courts of Illusion". As far as Ricardian fiction goes I think the best novel is Rhoda Edwards 'Some Touch of Pity". But the best ever historical novel, and imo streets ahead of any other, is 'The Eagle and the Raven' by Pauline Gedge, set at the time of the Boudiccan rebellion against Roman rule. You can smell the grass and woodsmoke, if you know what I mean!
> Paul
>
> On 27 Aug 2012, at 18:12, liz williams wrote:
>
> > I think We Speak No Treason is one of the greatest historical novels I've ever read and I never fail to sob at Richard's death. I don't know why she stopped writing them.
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@...>
> > To:
> > Sent: Monday, 27 August 2012, 17:47
> > Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> >
> >
> >
> > Good idea Roslyn about leaving a few little notes in the book before parting with it...
> >
> > Yes...Sharon Penman's Sunne in Splendour is magnificent...There is other Ricardian fiction as good...
> > We Speak No Treason by Rosemary Hawley Jarman...you cannot help but wonder... was this how it happened? Her dealing with the death and burial of Richard cannot fail but to move, as does the White Queen/Lesley Nickell...which is so moving in parts that tears prick my eyes when I read it. This is what a good author who knows their stuff can do. Other favourites Under the Hog/Patrick Carleton....he so captures the characters of the three Yorkist brothers..excellent...and Some Touch of Pity/Rhoda Edwards...
> >
> > How long will we have to wait before we get something else as goods as these I dont know..Eileen
> >
> > --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, fayre rose <fayreroze@> wrote:
> >>
> >> make sure you leave notes throughout the book when you donate it..referring the reader to the r3 society website or recommending better written and informed books. penman leaps to mind.
> >> Â
> >> i am reading my first p.gregory book. i'm not impressed with the author's choppy writing style.
> >> her knowledge is superficial and her charactor is simpering. a pale pastel shadow of what jacquetta woodville would have been. jacquetta was a dark and powerful force, not a benign victim of her surroundings and situations.
> >> Â
> >> the bottom line is i am not really enjoying the book, but continue to read it "just to see" gregory's take on the era. i don't think i got value for my dollar, even if i did get the book in the discount bin at the local grocery store.
> >> Â
> >> roslynÂ
> >>
> >> --- On Sun, 8/26/12, EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> >> Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> >> To: mailto:%40yahoogroups.com
> >> Received: Sunday, August 26, 2012, 8:00 PM
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Â
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Oh dearie me...Im reading this book too....The Kingmakers Daughter...I had not read the others by this author...but could not resist because this one was about Anne Neville...
> >> It is pretty dire... well actually very dire....As pointed out by Paul...the York Brothers..(2 or 3?).."working together as one dark assassin go into the room of the sleeping king (Henry) and hold a pillow over his face"..hilarious!...Later on...Cicely Neville throws a hissy fit on learning that George has chosen to drown in Malmsey..when Anne offers her a glass of Malmsey she strikes the glass away "No No she screams "dont bring it near me"....and on speaking of Clarences's two little children.."Orphans and paupers" she says acutely, drying her cunning old face"..priceless!.......On the plus side...most of the chapters are only about 3 pages long so you can zip through it in next to no time before you hoist it on to some other unsuspecting soul...My copy will be going to the Cat Protection League for one of their sales...so it wont be a total waste of money.Eileen
> >>
> >> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, "Lisa @ The Antiques Boutique" <lisa.holtjones@> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> LOL - I left my copy of the White Queen (MB) on the plane for some other
> >>> poor soul...! My Alison Weir Princes in the tower was fuel for my wood
> >>> stove!
> >>>
> >>> On 26 August 2012 19:31, ricard1an <maryfriend@> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> **
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> It is completely unbelievable that in this day and age someone could write
> >>>> such rubbish. I have not read any of her books and quite frankly I don't
> >>>> want to. I will probably force myself to watch the BBC rubbish so that I
> >>>> can ring them to complain.
> >>>> Loyaulte me lie.
> >>>>
> >>>> Mary
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, Paul Trevor Bale
> >>>> <paul.bale@> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Unfortunately your wish is about to come true!!
> >>>>> The BBC is also dramatising Philippa Gregory's novels about Elizabeth
> >>>> Woodville and Margaret Beaufort.
> >>>>> I got hold of a copy of her new one which is about Anne Neville.
> >>>>> It fell open at the page where Richard and George, on Edward's orders,
> >>>> go and put a pillow over poor Henry VI's face! Yes, personally, with a
> >>>> pillow!
> >>>>> I also found where the Duchess of York cries hearing that Clarence, on
> >>>> being given a choice of execution method has chosen drowning in a butt of
> >>>> malmsey!!
> >>>>> Clearly she has researched the period and characters carefully, with a
> >>>> copy of Shakespeare and maybe More at hand!!!
> >>>>> I am not looking forward to reading it, but will force myself to in
> >>>> order to find out what other nonsense she has to say about the York family
> >>>> and Richard in particular, before I chuck it away! A very long way away I
> >>>> think it will be!
> >>>>> Paul
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On 26 Aug 2012, at 19:07, EileenB wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Ah that is true very true David....but I do wish absolutely we could
> >>>> have some Plantagenet stuff for a change.....pleeeeease....
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> changing subject...I wonder how the dig will progress this
> >>>> week....Hope the weather holds for them....Torrential rain tomorrow but I
> >>>> doubt that they will be doing anything over the weekend/bank holiday
> >>>> anyway....Eileen
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, david rayner
> >>>> <theblackprussian@> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Be careful what you wish for...
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> ________________________________
> >>>>>>> From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> >>>>>>> To: mailto:%40yahoogroups.com
> >>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, 26 August 2012, 18:22
> >>>>>>> Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard
> >>>> III's remains
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Ã
> >>>>>>> I see that Hilary Mantell's books Wolf Hall and Bring Up the Bodies
> >>>> are going to be made into mini series by BBC2.....notwithstanding that
> >>>> these books are excellent is it not about time the BBC grasped the fact
> >>>> that there are other dynasties other than the Tudors....? I should think
> >>>> the general public are growing heartily sick of Henry Vlll and his
> >>>> shenanagans...Eileen
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, Paul Trevor Bale
> >>>> <paul.bale@> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> The Tony Robinson show!!!
> >>>>>>>> He has already done the show about "Tony Robinson and the real king
> >>>> of England" [Edward IV was illegitimate theory] and "Tony and the real
> >>>> Bosworth" [where the battle was actually fought - though in watching the
> >>>> show you wonder where they got the title Bosworth from as not a great deal
> >>>> of it was about Bosworth!]
> >>>>>>>> So unless there is an awful lot of publicity I don't see him getting
> >>>> involved again. I tried to get the company he uses interested in Richard
> >>>> five times during the 90s, and kept being fobbed off with excuses. Then I
> >>>> approached them mentioning Michael Jones as a possible contributo. Next
> >>>> thing I knew the programme about Edward IV was announced. Nice trip to
> >>>> Australia for Tony and his crew!!
> >>>>>>>> Paul
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On 24 Aug 2012, at 20:05, Robert Fripp wrote:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Trying to rouse interest in a documentary out of the blue is
> >>>> usually a lost cause. Go straight to someone who produces the particular
> >>>> topic that interests you. In Britain I suggest you approach... I have a
> >>>> block against his name! He's a bumptious little chap who is the presenter
> >>>> on a series about archaeology in Britain. His programs would be good if he
> >>>> would only learn to keep his face off the screen and restrict himself to
> >>>> voice-over.--[A short interval passes here while I look him up.]--Google
> >>>> just informed me that his name is Tony Robinson. What is needed is a small
> >>>> delegation of Ricardians to make a short presentation in person to Mr.
> >>>> Robinson. I bet he would agree to meet such a group.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Another search reveals that his series is called "Time Team". /
> >>>> Robert Fripp
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Richard Liveth Yet!
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ------------------------------------
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Richard Liveth Yet!
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Lisa
> >>> The Antiques Boutique & Ceramic Restoration/Conservation Services
> >>> Baddeck, Nova Scotia.
> >>> Tel: 902 295 9013 / 1329
> >>>
> >>> www.Antiques-Boutique.com <http://www.antiques-boutique.com/>
> >>> Like us on *www.facebook.com/TheAntiquesBoutique*
> >>> View our Ceramic Restoration Photos
> >>> <https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.398988066799604.100100.108554399176307&type=1&l=cd560aff9f>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>
> Richard Liveth Yet!
>

Thanks Roslyn...that is a very interesting link....and a lot of reading there.

It was me who asked for thoughts on why Margaret had taken Anne with her on the Tewksbury march....I think you have hit the nail on the head there. Thanks for pointing that out...I had not thought of it.

I think it is also highly likely that Anne had other pregnancies/still births etc., I wonder if things might have turned out differently for Richard had he more sons with Anne. But come to think of it...it has not helped other royal families who have had large families....

Wonder how the dig is coming on?

Eileen

--- In , fayre rose <fayreroze@...> wrote:
>
> this one isn't showing as received..apologies if it becomes a double post.
>
> --- On Tue, 8/28/12, fayre rose <fayreroze@...> wrote:
>
>
> From: fayre rose <fayreroze@...>
> Subject: Re: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> To:
> Received: Tuesday, August 28, 2012, 12:08 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> anne lived a life of status and priviledge until her father rebelled against e4. she then hit even higher status with the marriage to h6's son, the heir presumptive to the crown.
>  
> someone asked earlier why margaret took anne with her when edward was killed. it is very likely that margaret wanted to ensure that *if* anne was pregnant..that margaret would control the fate of the possible unborn child.
>  
> if a queen was widowed in that era, she was often locked up for a few of months after the date of the death of her husband the king. this was to ensure any issue born to the widowed queen was indeed the king's and not an unknown lover. the mother of an heir to the throne would weild great power. therefore it was necessary to ensure that the father was indeed the king. they didn't have paternity tests in those days.
>  
> but back to anne. i read recently that it is possible she and richard had more children than just edward. she may have suffered miscarriages and deaths of young children.
>  
> i'm reasonably sure i found the info at this website.
> http://www.silverboar.org/news13.htm#3
>  
> see where it says news13..change the number up and down to access more of these newsletters. some are quite good and informative.
> yes..it is the silverboar website.
> http://www.silverboar.org/news9.htm#authenticity
> the children of richard, is the title of the article.
>
> --- On Tue, 8/28/12, EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@...> wrote:
>
>
> From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@...>
> Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> To:
> Received: Tuesday, August 28, 2012, 10:05 AM
>
>
>
>  
>
>
>
> I think Anne was used as a prawn...sorry pawn...as a child regarding marriage. This was commonplace with 15th century noble families and nothing unusual there....In fact I guess the York brothers got off lightly with being able to choose their own brides...but hey look where this got Edward!
> This of course does not make her a weak adult and possibly quite the reverse. I would have thought that the various ups and downs she had through her very early years made her a better person, kind and understanding of other peoples troubles. Once she had found her own feet..with her marriage.. I think she had a very good life up until tragedy struck with the death of her son. Eileen
>
> --- In , Paul Trevor Bale <paul.bale@> wrote:
> >
> > I found her style in 'Treason' a bit flowery and purple in places. I much preferred her follow up novel about Perkin Warbeck "The Courts of Illusion". As far as Ricardian fiction goes I think the best novel is Rhoda Edwards 'Some Touch of Pity". But the best ever historical novel, and imo streets ahead of any other, is 'The Eagle and the Raven' by Pauline Gedge, set at the time of the Boudiccan rebellion against Roman rule. You can smell the grass and woodsmoke, if you know what I mean!
> > Paul
> >
> > On 27 Aug 2012, at 18:12, liz williams wrote:
> >
> > > I think We Speak No Treason is one of the greatest historical novels I've ever read and I never fail to sob at Richard's death. I don't know why she stopped writing them.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > > To:
> > > Sent: Monday, 27 August 2012, 17:47
> > > Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Good idea Roslyn about leaving a few little notes in the book before parting with it...
> > >
> > > Yes...Sharon Penman's Sunne in Splendour is magnificent...There is other Ricardian fiction as good...
> > > We Speak No Treason by Rosemary Hawley Jarman...you cannot help but wonder... was this how it happened? Her dealing with the death and burial of Richard cannot fail but to move, as does the White Queen/Lesley Nickell...which is so moving in parts that tears prick my eyes when I read it. This is what a good author who knows their stuff can do. Other favourites Under the Hog/Patrick Carleton....he so captures the characters of the three Yorkist brothers..excellent...and Some Touch of Pity/Rhoda Edwards...
> > >
> > > How long will we have to wait before we get something else as goods as these I dont know..Eileen
> > >
> > > --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, fayre rose <fayreroze@> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> make sure you leave notes throughout the book when you donate it..referring the reader to the r3 society website or recommending better written and informed books. penman leaps to mind.
> > >> Â
> > >> i am reading my first p.gregory book. i'm not impressed with the author's choppy writing style.
> > >> her knowledge is superficial and her charactor is simpering. a pale pastel shadow of what jacquetta woodville would have been. jacquetta was a dark and powerful force, not a benign victim of her surroundings and situations.
> > >> Â
> > >> the bottom line is i am not really enjoying the book, but continue to read it "just to see" gregory's take on the era. i don't think i got value for my dollar, even if i did get the book in the discount bin at the local grocery store.
> > >> Â
> > >> roslynÂ
> > >>
> > >> --- On Sun, 8/26/12, EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > >> Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > >> To: mailto:%40yahoogroups.com
> > >> Received: Sunday, August 26, 2012, 8:00 PM
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Â
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Oh dearie me...Im reading this book too....The Kingmakers Daughter...I had not read the others by this author...but could not resist because this one was about Anne Neville...
> > >> It is pretty dire... well actually very dire....As pointed out by Paul...the York Brothers..(2 or 3?).."working together as one dark assassin go into the room of the sleeping king (Henry) and hold a pillow over his face"..hilarious!...Later on...Cicely Neville throws a hissy fit on learning that George has chosen to drown in Malmsey..when Anne offers her a glass of Malmsey she strikes the glass away "No No she screams "dont bring it near me"....and on speaking of Clarences's two little children.."Orphans and paupers" she says acutely, drying her cunning old face"..priceless!.......On the plus side...most of the chapters are only about 3 pages long so you can zip through it in next to no time before you hoist it on to some other unsuspecting soul...My copy will be going to the Cat Protection League for one of their sales...so it wont be a total waste of money.Eileen
> > >>
> > >> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, "Lisa @ The Antiques Boutique" <lisa.holtjones@> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> LOL - I left my copy of the White Queen (MB) on the plane for some other
> > >>> poor soul...! My Alison Weir Princes in the tower was fuel for my wood
> > >>> stove!
> > >>>
> > >>> On 26 August 2012 19:31, ricard1an <maryfriend@> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>> **
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> It is completely unbelievable that in this day and age someone could write
> > >>>> such rubbish. I have not read any of her books and quite frankly I don't
> > >>>> want to. I will probably force myself to watch the BBC rubbish so that I
> > >>>> can ring them to complain.
> > >>>> Loyaulte me lie.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Mary
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, Paul Trevor Bale
> > >>>> <paul.bale@> wrote:
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> Unfortunately your wish is about to come true!!
> > >>>>> The BBC is also dramatising Philippa Gregory's novels about Elizabeth
> > >>>> Woodville and Margaret Beaufort.
> > >>>>> I got hold of a copy of her new one which is about Anne Neville.
> > >>>>> It fell open at the page where Richard and George, on Edward's orders,
> > >>>> go and put a pillow over poor Henry VI's face! Yes, personally, with a
> > >>>> pillow!
> > >>>>> I also found where the Duchess of York cries hearing that Clarence, on
> > >>>> being given a choice of execution method has chosen drowning in a butt of
> > >>>> malmsey!!
> > >>>>> Clearly she has researched the period and characters carefully, with a
> > >>>> copy of Shakespeare and maybe More at hand!!!
> > >>>>> I am not looking forward to reading it, but will force myself to in
> > >>>> order to find out what other nonsense she has to say about the York family
> > >>>> and Richard in particular, before I chuck it away! A very long way away I
> > >>>> think it will be!
> > >>>>> Paul
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> On 26 Aug 2012, at 19:07, EileenB wrote:
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> Ah that is true very true David....but I do wish absolutely we could
> > >>>> have some Plantagenet stuff for a change.....pleeeeease....
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> changing subject...I wonder how the dig will progress this
> > >>>> week....Hope the weather holds for them....Torrential rain tomorrow but I
> > >>>> doubt that they will be doing anything over the weekend/bank holiday
> > >>>> anyway....Eileen
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, david rayner
> > >>>> <theblackprussian@> wrote:
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> Be careful what you wish for...
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> ________________________________
> > >>>>>>> From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > >>>>>>> To: mailto:%40yahoogroups.com
> > >>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, 26 August 2012, 18:22
> > >>>>>>> Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard
> > >>>> III's remains
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> Â
> > >>>>>>> I see that Hilary Mantell's books Wolf Hall and Bring Up the Bodies
> > >>>> are going to be made into mini series by BBC2.....notwithstanding that
> > >>>> these books are excellent is it not about time the BBC grasped the fact
> > >>>> that there are other dynasties other than the Tudors....? I should think
> > >>>> the general public are growing heartily sick of Henry Vlll and his
> > >>>> shenanagans...Eileen
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, Paul Trevor Bale
> > >>>> <paul.bale@> wrote:
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>> The Tony Robinson show!!!
> > >>>>>>>> He has already done the show about "Tony Robinson and the real king
> > >>>> of England" [Edward IV was illegitimate theory] and "Tony and the real
> > >>>> Bosworth" [where the battle was actually fought - though in watching the
> > >>>> show you wonder where they got the title Bosworth from as not a great deal
> > >>>> of it was about Bosworth!]
> > >>>>>>>> So unless there is an awful lot of publicity I don't see him getting
> > >>>> involved again. I tried to get the company he uses interested in Richard
> > >>>> five times during the 90s, and kept being fobbed off with excuses. Then I
> > >>>> approached them mentioning Michael Jones as a possible contributo. Next
> > >>>> thing I knew the programme about Edward IV was announced. Nice trip to
> > >>>> Australia for Tony and his crew!!
> > >>>>>>>> Paul
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>> On 24 Aug 2012, at 20:05, Robert Fripp wrote:
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> Trying to rouse interest in a documentary out of the blue is
> > >>>> usually a lost cause. Go straight to someone who produces the particular
> > >>>> topic that interests you. In Britain I suggest you approach... I have a
> > >>>> block against his name! He's a bumptious little chap who is the presenter
> > >>>> on a series about archaeology in Britain. His programs would be good if he
> > >>>> would only learn to keep his face off the screen and restrict himself to
> > >>>> voice-over.--[A short interval passes here while I look him up.]--Google
> > >>>> just informed me that his name is Tony Robinson. What is needed is a small
> > >>>> delegation of Ricardians to make a short presentation in person to Mr.
> > >>>> Robinson. I bet he would agree to meet such a group.
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> Another search reveals that his series is called "Time Team". /
> > >>>> Robert Fripp
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>> Richard Liveth Yet!
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> ------------------------------------
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> Richard Liveth Yet!
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>> --
> > >>> Lisa
> > >>> The Antiques Boutique & Ceramic Restoration/Conservation Services
> > >>> Baddeck, Nova Scotia.
> > >>> Tel: 902 295 9013 / 1329
> > >>>
> > >>> www.Antiques-Boutique.com <http://www.antiques-boutique.com/>
> > >>> Like us on *www.facebook.com/TheAntiquesBoutique*
> > >>> View our Ceramic Restoration Photos
> > >>> <https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.398988066799604.100100.108554399176307&type=1&l=cd560aff9f>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > Richard Liveth Yet!
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

This is in the Daily Mail today....


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2195124/Archaeologists-searching-King-Richard-III-council-car-park-reveal-church-buried-Battle-Bosworth.html

Heavy rain at the moment in the Midlands and tomorrow too....Not helpful...Eileen


--- In , "EileenB" <cherryripe.eileenb@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Roslyn...that is a very interesting link....and a lot of reading there.
>
> It was me who asked for thoughts on why Margaret had taken Anne with her on the Tewksbury march....I think you have hit the nail on the head there. Thanks for pointing that out...I had not thought of it.
>
> I think it is also highly likely that Anne had other pregnancies/still births etc., I wonder if things might have turned out differently for Richard had he more sons with Anne. But come to think of it...it has not helped other royal families who have had large families....
>
> Wonder how the dig is coming on?
>
> Eileen
>
> --- In , fayre rose <fayreroze@> wrote:
> >
> > this one isn't showing as received..apologies if it becomes a double post.
> >
> > --- On Tue, 8/28/12, fayre rose <fayreroze@> wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: fayre rose <fayreroze@>
> > Subject: Re: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > To:
> > Received: Tuesday, August 28, 2012, 12:08 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > anne lived a life of status and priviledge until her father rebelled against e4. she then hit even higher status with the marriage to h6's son, the heir presumptive to the crown.
> >  
> > someone asked earlier why margaret took anne with her when edward was killed. it is very likely that margaret wanted to ensure that *if* anne was pregnant..that margaret would control the fate of the possible unborn child.
> >  
> > if a queen was widowed in that era, she was often locked up for a few of months after the date of the death of her husband the king. this was to ensure any issue born to the widowed queen was indeed the king's and not an unknown lover. the mother of an heir to the throne would weild great power. therefore it was necessary to ensure that the father was indeed the king. they didn't have paternity tests in those days.
> >  
> > but back to anne. i read recently that it is possible she and richard had more children than just edward. she may have suffered miscarriages and deaths of young children.
> >  
> > i'm reasonably sure i found the info at this website.
> > http://www.silverboar.org/news13.htm#3
> >  
> > see where it says news13..change the number up and down to access more of these newsletters. some are quite good and informative.
> > yes..it is the silverboar website.
> > http://www.silverboar.org/news9.htm#authenticity
> > the children of richard, is the title of the article.
> >
> > --- On Tue, 8/28/12, EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@> wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > To:
> > Received: Tuesday, August 28, 2012, 10:05 AM
> >
> >
> >
> >  
> >
> >
> >
> > I think Anne was used as a prawn...sorry pawn...as a child regarding marriage. This was commonplace with 15th century noble families and nothing unusual there....In fact I guess the York brothers got off lightly with being able to choose their own brides...but hey look where this got Edward!
> > This of course does not make her a weak adult and possibly quite the reverse. I would have thought that the various ups and downs she had through her very early years made her a better person, kind and understanding of other peoples troubles. Once she had found her own feet..with her marriage.. I think she had a very good life up until tragedy struck with the death of her son. Eileen
> >
> > --- In , Paul Trevor Bale <paul.bale@> wrote:
> > >
> > > I found her style in 'Treason' a bit flowery and purple in places. I much preferred her follow up novel about Perkin Warbeck "The Courts of Illusion". As far as Ricardian fiction goes I think the best novel is Rhoda Edwards 'Some Touch of Pity". But the best ever historical novel, and imo streets ahead of any other, is 'The Eagle and the Raven' by Pauline Gedge, set at the time of the Boudiccan rebellion against Roman rule. You can smell the grass and woodsmoke, if you know what I mean!
> > > Paul
> > >
> > > On 27 Aug 2012, at 18:12, liz williams wrote:
> > >
> > > > I think We Speak No Treason is one of the greatest historical novels I've ever read and I never fail to sob at Richard's death. I don't know why she stopped writing them.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ________________________________
> > > > From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > > > To:
> > > > Sent: Monday, 27 August 2012, 17:47
> > > > Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Good idea Roslyn about leaving a few little notes in the book before parting with it...
> > > >
> > > > Yes...Sharon Penman's Sunne in Splendour is magnificent...There is other Ricardian fiction as good...
> > > > We Speak No Treason by Rosemary Hawley Jarman...you cannot help but wonder... was this how it happened? Her dealing with the death and burial of Richard cannot fail but to move, as does the White Queen/Lesley Nickell...which is so moving in parts that tears prick my eyes when I read it. This is what a good author who knows their stuff can do. Other favourites Under the Hog/Patrick Carleton....he so captures the characters of the three Yorkist brothers..excellent...and Some Touch of Pity/Rhoda Edwards...
> > > >
> > > > How long will we have to wait before we get something else as goods as these I dont know..Eileen
> > > >
> > > > --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, fayre rose <fayreroze@> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> make sure you leave notes throughout the book when you donate it..referring the reader to the r3 society website or recommending better written and informed books. penman leaps to mind.
> > > >> Â
> > > >> i am reading my first p.gregory book. i'm not impressed with the author's choppy writing style.
> > > >> her knowledge is superficial and her charactor is simpering. a pale pastel shadow of what jacquetta woodville would have been. jacquetta was a dark and powerful force, not a benign victim of her surroundings and situations.
> > > >> Â
> > > >> the bottom line is i am not really enjoying the book, but continue to read it "just to see" gregory's take on the era. i don't think i got value for my dollar, even if i did get the book in the discount bin at the local grocery store.
> > > >> Â
> > > >> roslynÂ
> > > >>
> > > >> --- On Sun, 8/26/12, EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > > >> Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > > >> To: mailto:%40yahoogroups.com
> > > >> Received: Sunday, August 26, 2012, 8:00 PM
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> Â
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> Oh dearie me...Im reading this book too....The Kingmakers Daughter...I had not read the others by this author...but could not resist because this one was about Anne Neville...
> > > >> It is pretty dire... well actually very dire....As pointed out by Paul...the York Brothers..(2 or 3?).."working together as one dark assassin go into the room of the sleeping king (Henry) and hold a pillow over his face"..hilarious!...Later on...Cicely Neville throws a hissy fit on learning that George has chosen to drown in Malmsey..when Anne offers her a glass of Malmsey she strikes the glass away "No No she screams "dont bring it near me"....and on speaking of Clarences's two little children.."Orphans and paupers" she says acutely, drying her cunning old face"..priceless!.......On the plus side...most of the chapters are only about 3 pages long so you can zip through it in next to no time before you hoist it on to some other unsuspecting soul...My copy will be going to the Cat Protection League for one of their sales...so it wont be a total waste of money.Eileen
> > > >>
> > > >> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, "Lisa @ The Antiques Boutique" <lisa.holtjones@> wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>> LOL - I left my copy of the White Queen (MB) on the plane for some other
> > > >>> poor soul...! My Alison Weir Princes in the tower was fuel for my wood
> > > >>> stove!
> > > >>>
> > > >>> On 26 August 2012 19:31, ricard1an <maryfriend@> wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>>> **
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> It is completely unbelievable that in this day and age someone could write
> > > >>>> such rubbish. I have not read any of her books and quite frankly I don't
> > > >>>> want to. I will probably force myself to watch the BBC rubbish so that I
> > > >>>> can ring them to complain.
> > > >>>> Loyaulte me lie.
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> Mary
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, Paul Trevor Bale
> > > >>>> <paul.bale@> wrote:
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>> Unfortunately your wish is about to come true!!
> > > >>>>> The BBC is also dramatising Philippa Gregory's novels about Elizabeth
> > > >>>> Woodville and Margaret Beaufort.
> > > >>>>> I got hold of a copy of her new one which is about Anne Neville.
> > > >>>>> It fell open at the page where Richard and George, on Edward's orders,
> > > >>>> go and put a pillow over poor Henry VI's face! Yes, personally, with a
> > > >>>> pillow!
> > > >>>>> I also found where the Duchess of York cries hearing that Clarence, on
> > > >>>> being given a choice of execution method has chosen drowning in a butt of
> > > >>>> malmsey!!
> > > >>>>> Clearly she has researched the period and characters carefully, with a
> > > >>>> copy of Shakespeare and maybe More at hand!!!
> > > >>>>> I am not looking forward to reading it, but will force myself to in
> > > >>>> order to find out what other nonsense she has to say about the York family
> > > >>>> and Richard in particular, before I chuck it away! A very long way away I
> > > >>>> think it will be!
> > > >>>>> Paul
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>> On 26 Aug 2012, at 19:07, EileenB wrote:
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>> Ah that is true very true David....but I do wish absolutely we could
> > > >>>> have some Plantagenet stuff for a change.....pleeeeease....
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> changing subject...I wonder how the dig will progress this
> > > >>>> week....Hope the weather holds for them....Torrential rain tomorrow but I
> > > >>>> doubt that they will be doing anything over the weekend/bank holiday
> > > >>>> anyway....Eileen
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, david rayner
> > > >>>> <theblackprussian@> wrote:
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> Be careful what you wish for...
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> ________________________________
> > > >>>>>>> From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > > >>>>>>> To: mailto:%40yahoogroups.com
> > > >>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, 26 August 2012, 18:22
> > > >>>>>>> Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard
> > > >>>> III's remains
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> Â
> > > >>>>>>> I see that Hilary Mantell's books Wolf Hall and Bring Up the Bodies
> > > >>>> are going to be made into mini series by BBC2.....notwithstanding that
> > > >>>> these books are excellent is it not about time the BBC grasped the fact
> > > >>>> that there are other dynasties other than the Tudors....? I should think
> > > >>>> the general public are growing heartily sick of Henry Vlll and his
> > > >>>> shenanagans...Eileen
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, Paul Trevor Bale
> > > >>>> <paul.bale@> wrote:
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>> The Tony Robinson show!!!
> > > >>>>>>>> He has already done the show about "Tony Robinson and the real king
> > > >>>> of England" [Edward IV was illegitimate theory] and "Tony and the real
> > > >>>> Bosworth" [where the battle was actually fought - though in watching the
> > > >>>> show you wonder where they got the title Bosworth from as not a great deal
> > > >>>> of it was about Bosworth!]
> > > >>>>>>>> So unless there is an awful lot of publicity I don't see him getting
> > > >>>> involved again. I tried to get the company he uses interested in Richard
> > > >>>> five times during the 90s, and kept being fobbed off with excuses. Then I
> > > >>>> approached them mentioning Michael Jones as a possible contributo. Next
> > > >>>> thing I knew the programme about Edward IV was announced. Nice trip to
> > > >>>> Australia for Tony and his crew!!
> > > >>>>>>>> Paul
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>> On 24 Aug 2012, at 20:05, Robert Fripp wrote:
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> Trying to rouse interest in a documentary out of the blue is
> > > >>>> usually a lost cause. Go straight to someone who produces the particular
> > > >>>> topic that interests you. In Britain I suggest you approach... I have a
> > > >>>> block against his name! He's a bumptious little chap who is the presenter
> > > >>>> on a series about archaeology in Britain. His programs would be good if he
> > > >>>> would only learn to keep his face off the screen and restrict himself to
> > > >>>> voice-over.--[A short interval passes here while I look him up.]--Google
> > > >>>> just informed me that his name is Tony Robinson. What is needed is a small
> > > >>>> delegation of Ricardians to make a short presentation in person to Mr.
> > > >>>> Robinson. I bet he would agree to meet such a group.
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> Another search reveals that his series is called "Time Team". /
> > > >>>> Robert Fripp
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>> Richard Liveth Yet!
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> ------------------------------------
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>> Richard Liveth Yet!
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>> --
> > > >>> Lisa
> > > >>> The Antiques Boutique & Ceramic Restoration/Conservation Services
> > > >>> Baddeck, Nova Scotia.
> > > >>> Tel: 902 295 9013 / 1329
> > > >>>
> > > >>> www.Antiques-Boutique.com <http://www.antiques-boutique.com/>
> > > >>> Like us on *www.facebook.com/TheAntiquesBoutique*
> > > >>> View our Ceramic Restoration Photos
> > > >>> <https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.398988066799604.100100.108554399176307&type=1&l=cd560aff9f>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > Richard Liveth Yet!
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

Almost makes me wish I read the Daily Mail. Wonder who wrote the Ahistorical Review at the end...


________________________________
From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@...>
To:
Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 2:00 PM
Subject: Fw: Re: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains


 
This is in the Daily Mail today....

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2195124/Archaeologists-searching-King-Richard-III-council-car-park-reveal-church-buried-Battle-Bosworth.html

Heavy rain at the moment in the Midlands and tomorrow too....Not helpful...Eileen

--- In , "EileenB" <cherryripe.eileenb@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Roslyn...that is a very interesting link....and a lot of reading there.
>
> It was me who asked for thoughts on why Margaret had taken Anne with her on the Tewksbury march....I think you have hit the nail on the head there. Thanks for pointing that out...I had not thought of it.
>
> I think it is also highly likely that Anne had other pregnancies/still births etc., I wonder if things might have turned out differently for Richard had he more sons with Anne. But come to think of it...it has not helped other royal families who have had large families....
>
> Wonder how the dig is coming on?
>
> Eileen
>
> --- In , fayre rose <fayreroze@> wrote:
> >
> > this one isn't showing as received..apologies if it becomes a double post.
> >
> > --- On Tue, 8/28/12, fayre rose <fayreroze@> wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: fayre rose <fayreroze@>
> > Subject: Re: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > To:
> > Received: Tuesday, August 28, 2012, 12:08 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > anne lived a life of status and priviledge until her father rebelled against e4. she then hit even higher status with the marriage to h6's son, the heir presumptive to the crown.
> >  
> > someone asked earlier why margaret took anne with her when edward was killed. it is very likely that margaret wanted to ensure that *if* anne was pregnant..that margaret would control the fate of the possible unborn child.
> >  
> > if a queen was widowed in that era, she was often locked up for a few of months after the date of the death of her husband the king. this was to ensure any issue born to the widowed queen was indeed the king's and not an unknown lover. the mother of an heir to the throne would weild great power. therefore it was necessary to ensure that the father was indeed the king. they didn't have paternity tests in those days.
> >  
> > but back to anne. i read recently that it is possible she and richard had more children than just edward. she may have suffered miscarriages and deaths of young children.
> >  
> > i'm reasonably sure i found the info at this website.
> > http://www.silverboar.org/news13.htm#3
> >  
> > see where it says news13..change the number up and down to access more of these newsletters. some are quite good and informative.
> > yes..it is the silverboar website.
> > http://www.silverboar.org/news9.htm#authenticity
> > the children of richard, is the title of the article.
> >
> > --- On Tue, 8/28/12, EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@> wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > To:
> > Received: Tuesday, August 28, 2012, 10:05 AM
> >
> >
> >
> >  
> >
> >
> >
> > I think Anne was used as a prawn...sorry pawn...as a child regarding marriage. This was commonplace with 15th century noble families and nothing unusual there....In fact I guess the York brothers got off lightly with being able to choose their own brides...but hey look where this got Edward!
> > This of course does not make her a weak adult and possibly quite the reverse. I would have thought that the various ups and downs she had through her very early years made her a better person, kind and understanding of other peoples troubles. Once she had found her own feet..with her marriage.. I think she had a very good life up until tragedy struck with the death of her son. Eileen
> >
> > --- In , Paul Trevor Bale <paul.bale@> wrote:
> > >
> > > I found her style in 'Treason' a bit flowery and purple in places. I much preferred her follow up novel about Perkin Warbeck "The Courts of Illusion". As far as Ricardian fiction goes I think the best novel is Rhoda Edwards 'Some Touch of Pity". But the best ever historical novel, and imo streets ahead of any other, is 'The Eagle and the Raven' by Pauline Gedge, set at the time of the Boudiccan rebellion against Roman rule. You can smell the grass and woodsmoke, if you know what I mean!
> > > Paul
> > >
> > > On 27 Aug 2012, at 18:12, liz williams wrote:
> > >
> > > > I think We Speak No Treason is one of the greatest historical novels I've ever read and I never fail to sob at Richard's death. I don't know why she stopped writing them.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ________________________________
> > > > From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > > > To:
> > > > Sent: Monday, 27 August 2012, 17:47
> > > > Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Good idea Roslyn about leaving a few little notes in the book before parting with it...
> > > >
> > > > Yes...Sharon Penman's Sunne in Splendour is magnificent...There is other Ricardian fiction as good...
> > > > We Speak No Treason by Rosemary Hawley Jarman...you cannot help but wonder... was this how it happened? Her dealing with the death and burial of Richard cannot fail but to move, as does the White Queen/Lesley Nickell...which is so moving in parts that tears prick my eyes when I read it. This is what a good author who knows their stuff can do. Other favourites Under the Hog/Patrick Carleton....he so captures the characters of the three Yorkist brothers..excellent...and Some Touch of Pity/Rhoda Edwards...
> > > >
> > > > How long will we have to wait before we get something else as goods as these I dont know..Eileen
> > > >
> > > > --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, fayre rose <fayreroze@> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> make sure you leave notes throughout the book when you donate it..referring the reader to the r3 society website or recommending better written and informed books. penman leaps to mind.
> > > >> Ã
> > > >> i am reading my first p.gregory book. i'm not impressed with the author's choppy writing style.
> > > >> her knowledge is superficial and her charactor is simpering. a pale pastelà shadow of what jacquetta woodville would have been. jacquetta was a dark and powerful force, not a benign victim of her surroundings and situations.
> > > >> Ã
> > > >> the bottom line is i am not really enjoying the book, but continue to read it "just to see" gregory's take on the era. i don't think ià got value for my dollar, even if i did get the book in the discount bin at the local grocery store.
> > > >> Ã
> > > >> roslynÃ
> > > >>
> > > >> --- On Sun, 8/26/12, EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > > >> Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > > >> To: mailto:%40yahoogroups.com
> > > >> Received: Sunday, August 26, 2012, 8:00 PM
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> Ã
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> Oh dearie me...Im reading this book too....The Kingmakers Daughter...I had not read the others by this author...but could not resist because this one was about Anne Neville...
> > > >> It is pretty dire... well actually very dire....As pointed out by Paul...the York Brothers..(2 or 3?).."working together as one dark assassin go into the room of the sleeping king (Henry) and hold a pillow over his face"..hilarious!...Later on...Cicely Neville throws a hissy fit on learning that George has chosen to drown in Malmsey..when Anne offers her a glass of Malmsey she strikes the glass away "No No she screams "dont bring it near me"....and on speaking of Clarences's two little children.."Orphans and paupers" she says acutely, drying her cunning old face"..priceless!.......On the plus side...most of the chapters are only about 3 pages long so you can zip through it in next to no time before you hoist it on to some other unsuspecting soul...My copy will be going to the Cat Protection League for one of their sales...so it wont be a total waste of money.Eileen
> > > >>
> > > >> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, "Lisa @ The Antiques Boutique" <lisa.holtjones@> wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>> LOL - I left my copy of the White Queen (MB) on the plane for some other
> > > >>> poor soul...! My Alison Weir Princes in the tower was fuel for my wood
> > > >>> stove!
> > > >>>
> > > >>> On 26 August 2012 19:31, ricard1an <maryfriend@> wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>>> **
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> It is completely unbelievable that in this day and age someone could write
> > > >>>> such rubbish. I have not read any of her books and quite frankly I don't
> > > >>>> want to. I will probably force myself to watch the BBC rubbish so that I
> > > >>>> can ring them to complain.
> > > >>>> Loyaulte me lie.
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> Mary
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, Paul Trevor Bale
> > > >>>> <paul.bale@> wrote:
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>> Unfortunately your wish is about to come true!!
> > > >>>>> The BBC is also dramatising Philippa Gregory's novels about Elizabeth
> > > >>>> Woodville and Margaret Beaufort.
> > > >>>>> I got hold of a copy of her new one which is about Anne Neville.
> > > >>>>> It fell open at the page where Richard and George, on Edward's orders,
> > > >>>> go and put a pillow over poor Henry VI's face! Yes, personally, with a
> > > >>>> pillow!
> > > >>>>> I also found where the Duchess of York cries hearing that Clarence, on
> > > >>>> being given a choice of execution method has chosen drowning in a butt of
> > > >>>> malmsey!!
> > > >>>>> Clearly she has researched the period and characters carefully, with a
> > > >>>> copy of Shakespeare and maybe More at hand!!!
> > > >>>>> I am not looking forward to reading it, but will force myself to in
> > > >>>> order to find out what other nonsense she has to say about the York family
> > > >>>> and Richard in particular, before I chuck it away! A very long way away I
> > > >>>> think it will be!
> > > >>>>> Paul
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>> On 26 Aug 2012, at 19:07, EileenB wrote:
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>> Ah that is true very true David....but I do wish absolutely we could
> > > >>>> have some Plantagenet stuff for a change.....pleeeeease....
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> changing subject...I wonder how the dig will progress this
> > > >>>> week....Hope the weather holds for them....Torrential rain tomorrow but I
> > > >>>> doubt that they will be doing anything over the weekend/bank holiday
> > > >>>> anyway....Eileen
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, david rayner
> > > >>>> <theblackprussian@> wrote:
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> Be careful what you wish for...
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> ________________________________
> > > >>>>>>> From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > > >>>>>>> To: mailto:%40yahoogroups.com
> > > >>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, 26 August 2012, 18:22
> > > >>>>>>> Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard
> > > >>>> III's remains
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> Ã’â¬a
> > > >>>>>>> I see that Hilary Mantell's books Wolf Hall and Bring Up the Bodies
> > > >>>> are going to be made into mini series by BBC2.....notwithstanding that
> > > >>>> these books are excellent is it not about time the BBC grasped the fact
> > > >>>> that there are other dynasties other than the Tudors....? I should think
> > > >>>> the general public are growing heartily sick of Henry Vlll and his
> > > >>>> shenanagans...Eileen
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, Paul Trevor Bale
> > > >>>> <paul.bale@> wrote:
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>> The Tony Robinson show!!!
> > > >>>>>>>> He has already done the show about "Tony Robinson and the real king
> > > >>>> of England" [Edward IV was illegitimate theory] and "Tony and the real
> > > >>>> Bosworth" [where the battle was actually fought - though in watching the
> > > >>>> show you wonder where they got the title Bosworth from as not a great deal
> > > >>>> of it was about Bosworth!]
> > > >>>>>>>> So unless there is an awful lot of publicity I don't see him getting
> > > >>>> involved again. I tried to get the company he uses interested in Richard
> > > >>>> five times during the 90s, and kept being fobbed off with excuses. Then I
> > > >>>> approached them mentioning Michael Jones as a possible contributo. Next
> > > >>>> thing I knew the programme about Edward IV was announced. Nice trip to
> > > >>>> Australia for Tony and his crew!!
> > > >>>>>>>> Paul
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>> On 24 Aug 2012, at 20:05, Robert Fripp wrote:
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> Trying to rouse interest in a documentary out of the blue is
> > > >>>> usually a lost cause. Go straight to someone who produces the particular
> > > >>>> topic that interests you. In Britain I suggest you approach... I have a
> > > >>>> block against his name! He's a bumptious little chap who is the presenter
> > > >>>> on a series about archaeology in Britain. His programs would be good if he
> > > >>>> would only learn to keep his face off the screen and restrict himself to
> > > >>>> voice-over.--[A short interval passes here while I look him up.]--Google
> > > >>>> just informed me that his name is Tony Robinson. What is needed is a small
> > > >>>> delegation of Ricardians to make a short presentation in person to Mr.
> > > >>>> Robinson. I bet he would agree to meet such a group.
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> Another search reveals that his series is called "Time Team". /
> > > >>>> Robert Fripp
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>> Richard Liveth Yet!
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> ------------------------------------
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>> Richard Liveth Yet!
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>> --
> > > >>> Lisa
> > > >>> The Antiques Boutique & Ceramic Restoration/Conservation Services
> > > >>> Baddeck, Nova Scotia.
> > > >>> Tel: 902 295 9013 / 1329
> > > >>>
> > > >>> www.Antiques-Boutique.com <http://www.antiques-boutique.com/>
> > > >>> Like us on *www.facebook.com/TheAntiquesBoutique*
> > > >>> View our Ceramic Restoration Photos
> > > >>> <https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.398988066799604.100100.108554399176307&type=1&l=cd560aff9f>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > Richard Liveth Yet!
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

History, n. an account mostly false, of events mostly unimportant, which are brought about by rulers, mostly knaves, and soldiers, mostly fools. Ambrose Bierce. He a contemporary of Mark Twain.
bierce also penned the devil's dictionary. loads of wit and sarcasm are found within

--- On Wed, 8/29/12, Edward Shine <blancsanglier1452@...> wrote:


From: Edward Shine <blancsanglier1452@...>
Subject: Re: Re: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
To:
Received: Wednesday, August 29, 2012, 10:04 AM



 



Almost makes me wish I read the Daily Mail. Wonder who wrote the Ahistorical Review at the end...

________________________________
From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@...>
To:
Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 2:00 PM
Subject: Fw: Re: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains


 
This is in the Daily Mail today....

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2195124/Archaeologists-searching-King-Richard-III-council-car-park-reveal-church-buried-Battle-Bosworth.html

Heavy rain at the moment in the Midlands and tomorrow too....Not helpful...Eileen

--- In , "EileenB" <cherryripe.eileenb@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Roslyn...that is a very interesting link....and a lot of reading there.
>
> It was me who asked for thoughts on why Margaret had taken Anne with her on the Tewksbury march....I think you have hit the nail on the head there. Thanks for pointing that out...I had not thought of it.
>
> I think it is also highly likely that Anne had other pregnancies/still births etc., I wonder if things might have turned out differently for Richard had he more sons with Anne. But come to think of it...it has not helped other royal families who have had large families....
>
> Wonder how the dig is coming on?
>
> Eileen
>
> --- In , fayre rose <fayreroze@> wrote:
> >
> > this one isn't showing as received..apologies if it becomes a double post.
> >
> > --- On Tue, 8/28/12, fayre rose <fayreroze@> wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: fayre rose <fayreroze@>
> > Subject: Re: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > To:
> > Received: Tuesday, August 28, 2012, 12:08 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > anne lived a life of status and priviledge until her father rebelled against e4. she then hit even higher status with the marriage to h6's son, the heir presumptive to the crown.
> >  
> > someone asked earlier why margaret took anne with her when edward was killed. it is very likely that margaret wanted to ensure that *if* anne was pregnant..that margaret would control the fate of the possible unborn child.
> >  
> > if a queen was widowed in that era, she was often locked up for a few of months after the date of the death of her husband the king. this was to ensure any issue born to the widowed queen was indeed the king's and not an unknown lover. the mother of an heir to the throne would weild great power. therefore it was necessary to ensure that the father was indeed the king. they didn't have paternity tests in those days.
> >  
> > but back to anne. i read recently that it is possible she and richard had more children than just edward. she may have suffered miscarriages and deaths of young children.
> >  
> > i'm reasonably sure i found the info at this website.
> > http://www.silverboar.org/news13.htm#3
> >  
> > see where it says news13..change the number up and down to access more of these newsletters. some are quite good and informative.
> > yes..it is the silverboar website.
> > http://www.silverboar.org/news9.htm#authenticity
> > the children of richard, is the title of the article.
> >
> > --- On Tue, 8/28/12, EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@> wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > To:
> > Received: Tuesday, August 28, 2012, 10:05 AM
> >
> >
> >
> >  
> >
> >
> >
> > I think Anne was used as a prawn...sorry pawn...as a child regarding marriage. This was commonplace with 15th century noble families and nothing unusual there....In fact I guess the York brothers got off lightly with being able to choose their own brides...but hey look where this got Edward!
> > This of course does not make her a weak adult and possibly quite the reverse. I would have thought that the various ups and downs she had through her very early years made her a better person, kind and understanding of other peoples troubles. Once she had found her own feet..with her marriage.. I think she had a very good life up until tragedy struck with the death of her son. Eileen
> >
> > --- In , Paul Trevor Bale <paul.bale@> wrote:
> > >
> > > I found her style in 'Treason' a bit flowery and purple in places. I much preferred her follow up novel about Perkin Warbeck "The Courts of Illusion". As far as Ricardian fiction goes I think the best novel is Rhoda Edwards 'Some Touch of Pity". But the best ever historical novel, and imo streets ahead of any other, is 'The Eagle and the Raven' by Pauline Gedge, set at the time of the Boudiccan rebellion against Roman rule. You can smell the grass and woodsmoke, if you know what I mean!
> > > Paul
> > >
> > > On 27 Aug 2012, at 18:12, liz williams wrote:
> > >
> > > > I think We Speak No Treason is one of the greatest historical novels I've ever read and I never fail to sob at Richard's death. I don't know why she stopped writing them.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ________________________________
> > > > From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > > > To:
> > > > Sent: Monday, 27 August 2012, 17:47
> > > > Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Good idea Roslyn about leaving a few little notes in the book before parting with it...
> > > >
> > > > Yes...Sharon Penman's Sunne in Splendour is magnificent...There is other Ricardian fiction as good...
> > > > We Speak No Treason by Rosemary Hawley Jarman...you cannot help but wonder... was this how it happened? Her dealing with the death and burial of Richard cannot fail but to move, as does the White Queen/Lesley Nickell...which is so moving in parts that tears prick my eyes when I read it. This is what a good author who knows their stuff can do. Other favourites Under the Hog/Patrick Carleton....he so captures the characters of the three Yorkist brothers..excellent...and Some Touch of Pity/Rhoda Edwards...
> > > >
> > > > How long will we have to wait before we get something else as goods as these I dont know..Eileen
> > > >
> > > > --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, fayre rose <fayreroze@> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> make sure you leave notes throughout the book when you donate it..referring the reader to the r3 society website or recommending better written and informed books. penman leaps to mind.
> > > >> Ã
> > > >> i am reading my first p.gregory book. i'm not impressed with the author's choppy writing style.
> > > >> her knowledge is superficial and her charactor is simpering. a pale pastelà shadow of what jacquetta woodville would have been. jacquetta was a dark and powerful force, not a benign victim of her surroundings and situations.
> > > >> Ã
> > > >> the bottom line is i am not really enjoying the book, but continue to read it "just to see" gregory's take on the era. i don't think ià got value for my dollar, even if i did get the book in the discount bin at the local grocery store.
> > > >> Ã
> > > >> roslynÃ
> > > >>
> > > >> --- On Sun, 8/26/12, EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > > >> Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > > >> To: mailto:%40yahoogroups.com
> > > >> Received: Sunday, August 26, 2012, 8:00 PM
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> Ã
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> Oh dearie me...Im reading this book too....The Kingmakers Daughter...I had not read the others by this author...but could not resist because this one was about Anne Neville...
> > > >> It is pretty dire... well actually very dire....As pointed out by Paul...the York Brothers..(2 or 3?).."working together as one dark assassin go into the room of the sleeping king (Henry) and hold a pillow over his face"..hilarious!...Later on...Cicely Neville throws a hissy fit on learning that George has chosen to drown in Malmsey..when Anne offers her a glass of Malmsey she strikes the glass away "No No she screams "dont bring it near me"....and on speaking of Clarences's two little children.."Orphans and paupers" she says acutely, drying her cunning old face"..priceless!.......On the plus side...most of the chapters are only about 3 pages long so you can zip through it in next to no time before you hoist it on to some other unsuspecting soul...My copy will be going to the Cat Protection League for one of their sales...so it wont be a total waste of money.Eileen
> > > >>
> > > >> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, "Lisa @ The Antiques Boutique" <lisa.holtjones@> wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>> LOL - I left my copy of the White Queen (MB) on the plane for some other
> > > >>> poor soul...! My Alison Weir Princes in the tower was fuel for my wood
> > > >>> stove!
> > > >>>
> > > >>> On 26 August 2012 19:31, ricard1an <maryfriend@> wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>>> **
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> It is completely unbelievable that in this day and age someone could write
> > > >>>> such rubbish. I have not read any of her books and quite frankly I don't
> > > >>>> want to. I will probably force myself to watch the BBC rubbish so that I
> > > >>>> can ring them to complain.
> > > >>>> Loyaulte me lie.
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> Mary
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, Paul Trevor Bale
> > > >>>> <paul.bale@> wrote:
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>> Unfortunately your wish is about to come true!!
> > > >>>>> The BBC is also dramatising Philippa Gregory's novels about Elizabeth
> > > >>>> Woodville and Margaret Beaufort.
> > > >>>>> I got hold of a copy of her new one which is about Anne Neville.
> > > >>>>> It fell open at the page where Richard and George, on Edward's orders,
> > > >>>> go and put a pillow over poor Henry VI's face! Yes, personally, with a
> > > >>>> pillow!
> > > >>>>> I also found where the Duchess of York cries hearing that Clarence, on
> > > >>>> being given a choice of execution method has chosen drowning in a butt of
> > > >>>> malmsey!!
> > > >>>>> Clearly she has researched the period and characters carefully, with a
> > > >>>> copy of Shakespeare and maybe More at hand!!!
> > > >>>>> I am not looking forward to reading it, but will force myself to in
> > > >>>> order to find out what other nonsense she has to say about the York family
> > > >>>> and Richard in particular, before I chuck it away! A very long way away I
> > > >>>> think it will be!
> > > >>>>> Paul
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>> On 26 Aug 2012, at 19:07, EileenB wrote:
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>> Ah that is true very true David....but I do wish absolutely we could
> > > >>>> have some Plantagenet stuff for a change.....pleeeeease....
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> changing subject...I wonder how the dig will progress this
> > > >>>> week....Hope the weather holds for them....Torrential rain tomorrow but I
> > > >>>> doubt that they will be doing anything over the weekend/bank holiday
> > > >>>> anyway....Eileen
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, david rayner
> > > >>>> <theblackprussian@> wrote:
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> Be careful what you wish for...
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> ________________________________
> > > >>>>>>> From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > > >>>>>>> To: mailto:%40yahoogroups.com
> > > >>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, 26 August 2012, 18:22
> > > >>>>>>> Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard
> > > >>>> III's remains
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> Ã’â¬a
> > > >>>>>>> I see that Hilary Mantell's books Wolf Hall and Bring Up the Bodies
> > > >>>> are going to be made into mini series by BBC2.....notwithstanding that
> > > >>>> these books are excellent is it not about time the BBC grasped the fact
> > > >>>> that there are other dynasties other than the Tudors....? I should think
> > > >>>> the general public are growing heartily sick of Henry Vlll and his
> > > >>>> shenanagans...Eileen
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, Paul Trevor Bale
> > > >>>> <paul.bale@> wrote:
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>> The Tony Robinson show!!!
> > > >>>>>>>> He has already done the show about "Tony Robinson and the real king
> > > >>>> of England" [Edward IV was illegitimate theory] and "Tony and the real
> > > >>>> Bosworth" [where the battle was actually fought - though in watching the
> > > >>>> show you wonder where they got the title Bosworth from as not a great deal
> > > >>>> of it was about Bosworth!]
> > > >>>>>>>> So unless there is an awful lot of publicity I don't see him getting
> > > >>>> involved again. I tried to get the company he uses interested in Richard
> > > >>>> five times during the 90s, and kept being fobbed off with excuses. Then I
> > > >>>> approached them mentioning Michael Jones as a possible contributo. Next
> > > >>>> thing I knew the programme about Edward IV was announced. Nice trip to
> > > >>>> Australia for Tony and his crew!!
> > > >>>>>>>> Paul
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>> On 24 Aug 2012, at 20:05, Robert Fripp wrote:
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> Trying to rouse interest in a documentary out of the blue is
> > > >>>> usually a lost cause. Go straight to someone who produces the particular
> > > >>>> topic that interests you. In Britain I suggest you approach... I have a
> > > >>>> block against his name! He's a bumptious little chap who is the presenter
> > > >>>> on a series about archaeology in Britain. His programs would be good if he
> > > >>>> would only learn to keep his face off the screen and restrict himself to
> > > >>>> voice-over.--[A short interval passes here while I look him up.]--Google
> > > >>>> just informed me that his name is Tony Robinson. What is needed is a small
> > > >>>> delegation of Ricardians to make a short presentation in person to Mr.
> > > >>>> Robinson. I bet he would agree to meet such a group.
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> Another search reveals that his series is called "Time Team". /
> > > >>>> Robert Fripp
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>> Richard Liveth Yet!
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> ------------------------------------
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>> Richard Liveth Yet!
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>> --
> > > >>> Lisa
> > > >>> The Antiques Boutique & Ceramic Restoration/Conservation Services
> > > >>> Baddeck, Nova Scotia.
> > > >>> Tel: 902 295 9013 / 1329
> > > >>>
> > > >>> www.Antiques-Boutique.com <http://www.antiques-boutique.com/>
> > > >>> Like us on *www.facebook.com/TheAntiquesBoutique*
> > > >>> View our Ceramic Restoration Photos
> > > >>> <https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.398988066799604.100100.108554399176307&type=1&l=cd560aff9f>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > Richard Liveth Yet!
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

H'mmm just like the Daily Mail then :)


________________________________
From: fayre rose <fayreroze@...>
To:
Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 4:08 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains


 
History, n. an account mostly false, of events mostly unimportant, which are brought about by rulers, mostly knaves, and soldiers, mostly fools. Ambrose Bierce. He a contemporary of Mark Twain.
bierce also penned the devil's dictionary. loads of wit and sarcasm are found within

--- On Wed, 8/29/12, Edward Shine <blancsanglier1452@...> wrote:

From: Edward Shine <blancsanglier1452@...>
Subject: Re: Re: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
To:
Received: Wednesday, August 29, 2012, 10:04 AM

 

Almost makes me wish I read the Daily Mail. Wonder who wrote the Ahistorical Review at the end...

________________________________
From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@...>
To:
Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 2:00 PM
Subject: Fw: Re: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains

 
This is in the Daily Mail today....

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2195124/Archaeologists-searching-King-Richard-III-council-car-park-reveal-church-buried-Battle-Bosworth.html

Heavy rain at the moment in the Midlands and tomorrow too....Not helpful...Eileen

--- In , "EileenB" <cherryripe.eileenb@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Roslyn...that is a very interesting link....and a lot of reading there.
>
> It was me who asked for thoughts on why Margaret had taken Anne with her on the Tewksbury march....I think you have hit the nail on the head there. Thanks for pointing that out...I had not thought of it.
>
> I think it is also highly likely that Anne had other pregnancies/still births etc., I wonder if things might have turned out differently for Richard had he more sons with Anne. But come to think of it...it has not helped other royal families who have had large families....
>
> Wonder how the dig is coming on?
>
> Eileen
>
> --- In , fayre rose <fayreroze@> wrote:
> >
> > this one isn't showing as received..apologies if it becomes a double post.
> >
> > --- On Tue, 8/28/12, fayre rose <fayreroze@> wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: fayre rose <fayreroze@>
> > Subject: Re: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > To:
> > Received: Tuesday, August 28, 2012, 12:08 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > anne lived a life of status and priviledge until her father rebelled against e4. she then hit even higher status with the marriage to h6's son, the heir presumptive to the crown.
> >  
> > someone asked earlier why margaret took anne with her when edward was killed. it is very likely that margaret wanted to ensure that *if* anne was pregnant..that margaret would control the fate of the possible unborn child.
> >  
> > if a queen was widowed in that era, she was often locked up for a few of months after the date of the death of her husband the king. this was to ensure any issue born to the widowed queen was indeed the king's and not an unknown lover. the mother of an heir to the throne would weild great power. therefore it was necessary to ensure that the father was indeed the king. they didn't have paternity tests in those days.
> >  
> > but back to anne. i read recently that it is possible she and richard had more children than just edward. she may have suffered miscarriages and deaths of young children.
> >  
> > i'm reasonably sure i found the info at this website.
> > http://www.silverboar.org/news13.htm#3
> >  
> > see where it says news13..change the number up and down to access more of these newsletters. some are quite good and informative.
> > yes..it is the silverboar website.
> > http://www.silverboar.org/news9.htm#authenticity
> > the children of richard, is the title of the article.
> >
> > --- On Tue, 8/28/12, EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@> wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > To:
> > Received: Tuesday, August 28, 2012, 10:05 AM
> >
> >
> >
> >  
> >
> >
> >
> > I think Anne was used as a prawn...sorry pawn...as a child regarding marriage. This was commonplace with 15th century noble families and nothing unusual there....In fact I guess the York brothers got off lightly with being able to choose their own brides...but hey look where this got Edward!
> > This of course does not make her a weak adult and possibly quite the reverse. I would have thought that the various ups and downs she had through her very early years made her a better person, kind and understanding of other peoples troubles. Once she had found her own feet..with her marriage.. I think she had a very good life up until tragedy struck with the death of her son. Eileen
> >
> > --- In , Paul Trevor Bale <paul.bale@> wrote:
> > >
> > > I found her style in 'Treason' a bit flowery and purple in places. I much preferred her follow up novel about Perkin Warbeck "The Courts of Illusion". As far as Ricardian fiction goes I think the best novel is Rhoda Edwards 'Some Touch of Pity". But the best ever historical novel, and imo streets ahead of any other, is 'The Eagle and the Raven' by Pauline Gedge, set at the time of the Boudiccan rebellion against Roman rule. You can smell the grass and woodsmoke, if you know what I mean!
> > > Paul
> > >
> > > On 27 Aug 2012, at 18:12, liz williams wrote:
> > >
> > > > I think We Speak No Treason is one of the greatest historical novels I've ever read and I never fail to sob at Richard's death. I don't know why she stopped writing them.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ________________________________
> > > > From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > > > To:
> > > > Sent: Monday, 27 August 2012, 17:47
> > > > Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Good idea Roslyn about leaving a few little notes in the book before parting with it...
> > > >
> > > > Yes...Sharon Penman's Sunne in Splendour is magnificent...There is other Ricardian fiction as good...
> > > > We Speak No Treason by Rosemary Hawley Jarman...you cannot help but wonder... was this how it happened? Her dealing with the death and burial of Richard cannot fail but to move, as does the White Queen/Lesley Nickell...which is so moving in parts that tears prick my eyes when I read it. This is what a good author who knows their stuff can do. Other favourites Under the Hog/Patrick Carleton....he so captures the characters of the three Yorkist brothers..excellent...and Some Touch of Pity/Rhoda Edwards...
> > > >
> > > > How long will we have to wait before we get something else as goods as these I dont know..Eileen
> > > >
> > > > --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, fayre rose <fayreroze@> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> make sure you leave notes throughout the book when you donate it..referring the reader to the r3 society website or recommending better written and informed books. penman leaps to mind.
> > > >> Ã
> > > >> i am reading my first p.gregory book. i'm not impressed with the author's choppy writing style.
> > > >> her knowledge is superficial and her charactor is simpering. a pale pastelà shadow of what jacquetta woodville would have been. jacquetta was a dark and powerful force, not a benign victim of her surroundings and situations.
> > > >> Ã
> > > >> the bottom line is i am not really enjoying the book, but continue to read it "just to see" gregory's take on the era. i don't think ià got value for my dollar, even if i did get the book in the discount bin at the local grocery store.
> > > >> Ã
> > > >> roslynÃ
> > > >>
> > > >> --- On Sun, 8/26/12, EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > > >> Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard III's remains
> > > >> To: mailto:%40yahoogroups.com
> > > >> Received: Sunday, August 26, 2012, 8:00 PM
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> Ã
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> Oh dearie me...Im reading this book too....The Kingmakers Daughter...I had not read the others by this author...but could not resist because this one was about Anne Neville...
> > > >> It is pretty dire... well actually very dire....As pointed out by Paul...the York Brothers..(2 or 3?).."working together as one dark assassin go into the room of the sleeping king (Henry) and hold a pillow over his face"..hilarious!...Later on...Cicely Neville throws a hissy fit on learning that George has chosen to drown in Malmsey..when Anne offers her a glass of Malmsey she strikes the glass away "No No she screams "dont bring it near me"....and on speaking of Clarences's two little children.."Orphans and paupers" she says acutely, drying her cunning old face"..priceless!.......On the plus side...most of the chapters are only about 3 pages long so you can zip through it in next to no time before you hoist it on to some other unsuspecting soul...My copy will be going to the Cat Protection League for one of their sales...so it wont be a total waste of money.Eileen
> > > >>
> > > >> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, "Lisa @ The Antiques Boutique" <lisa.holtjones@> wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>> LOL - I left my copy of the White Queen (MB) on the plane for some other
> > > >>> poor soul...! My Alison Weir Princes in the tower was fuel for my wood
> > > >>> stove!
> > > >>>
> > > >>> On 26 August 2012 19:31, ricard1an <maryfriend@> wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>>> **
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> It is completely unbelievable that in this day and age someone could write
> > > >>>> such rubbish. I have not read any of her books and quite frankly I don't
> > > >>>> want to. I will probably force myself to watch the BBC rubbish so that I
> > > >>>> can ring them to complain.
> > > >>>> Loyaulte me lie.
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> Mary
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, Paul Trevor Bale
> > > >>>> <paul.bale@> wrote:
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>> Unfortunately your wish is about to come true!!
> > > >>>>> The BBC is also dramatising Philippa Gregory's novels about Elizabeth
> > > >>>> Woodville and Margaret Beaufort.
> > > >>>>> I got hold of a copy of her new one which is about Anne Neville.
> > > >>>>> It fell open at the page where Richard and George, on Edward's orders,
> > > >>>> go and put a pillow over poor Henry VI's face! Yes, personally, with a
> > > >>>> pillow!
> > > >>>>> I also found where the Duchess of York cries hearing that Clarence, on
> > > >>>> being given a choice of execution method has chosen drowning in a butt of
> > > >>>> malmsey!!
> > > >>>>> Clearly she has researched the period and characters carefully, with a
> > > >>>> copy of Shakespeare and maybe More at hand!!!
> > > >>>>> I am not looking forward to reading it, but will force myself to in
> > > >>>> order to find out what other nonsense she has to say about the York family
> > > >>>> and Richard in particular, before I chuck it away! A very long way away I
> > > >>>> think it will be!
> > > >>>>> Paul
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>> On 26 Aug 2012, at 19:07, EileenB wrote:
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>> Ah that is true very true David....but I do wish absolutely we could
> > > >>>> have some Plantagenet stuff for a change.....pleeeeease....
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> changing subject...I wonder how the dig will progress this
> > > >>>> week....Hope the weather holds for them....Torrential rain tomorrow but I
> > > >>>> doubt that they will be doing anything over the weekend/bank holiday
> > > >>>> anyway....Eileen
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, david rayner
> > > >>>> <theblackprussian@> wrote:
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> Be careful what you wish for...
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> ________________________________
> > > >>>>>>> From: EileenB <cherryripe.eileenb@>
> > > >>>>>>> To: mailto:%40yahoogroups.com
> > > >>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, 26 August 2012, 18:22
> > > >>>>>>> Subject: Re: Documentary about Richard
> > > >>>> III's remains
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> Ã’â¬a
> > > >>>>>>> I see that Hilary Mantell's books Wolf Hall and Bring Up the Bodies
> > > >>>> are going to be made into mini series by BBC2.....notwithstanding that
> > > >>>> these books are excellent is it not about time the BBC grasped the fact
> > > >>>> that there are other dynasties other than the Tudors....? I should think
> > > >>>> the general public are growing heartily sick of Henry Vlll and his
> > > >>>> shenanagans...Eileen
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> --- In mailto:%40yahoogroups.com, Paul Trevor Bale
> > > >>>> <paul.bale@> wrote:
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>> The Tony Robinson show!!!
> > > >>>>>>>> He has already done the show about "Tony Robinson and the real king
> > > >>>> of England" [Edward IV was illegitimate theory] and "Tony and the real
> > > >>>> Bosworth" [where the battle was actually fought - though in watching the
> > > >>>> show you wonder where they got the title Bosworth from as not a great deal
> > > >>>> of it was about Bosworth!]
> > > >>>>>>>> So unless there is an awful lot of publicity I don't see him getting
> > > >>>> involved again. I tried to get the company he uses interested in Richard
> > > >>>> five times during the 90s, and kept being fobbed off with excuses. Then I
> > > >>>> approached them mentioning Michael Jones as a possible contributo. Next
> > > >>>> thing I knew the programme about Edward IV was announced. Nice trip to
> > > >>>> Australia for Tony and his crew!!
> > > >>>>>>>> Paul
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>> On 24 Aug 2012, at 20:05, Robert Fripp wrote:
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> Trying to rouse interest in a documentary out of the blue is
> > > >>>> usually a lost cause. Go straight to someone who produces the particular
> > > >>>> topic that interests you. In Britain I suggest you approach... I have a
> > > >>>> block against his name! He's a bumptious little chap who is the presenter
> > > >>>> on a series about archaeology in Britain. His programs would be good if he
> > > >>>> would only learn to keep his face off the screen and restrict himself to
> > > >>>> voice-over.--[A short interval passes here while I look him up.]--Google
> > > >>>> just informed me that his name is Tony Robinson. What is needed is a small
> > > >>>> delegation of Ricardians to make a short presentation in person to Mr.
> > > >>>> Robinson. I bet he would agree to meet such a group.
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> Another search reveals that his series is called "Time Team". /
> > > >>>> Robert Fripp
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>> Richard Liveth Yet!
> > > >>>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> ------------------------------------
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>> Richard Liveth Yet!
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>> --
> > > >>> Lisa
> > > >>> The Antiques Boutique & Ceramic Restoration/Conservation Services
> > > >>> Baddeck, Nova Scotia.
> > > >>> Tel: 902 295 9013 / 1329
> > > >>>
> > > >>> www.Antiques-Boutique.com <http://www.antiques-boutique.com/>
> > > >>> Like us on *www.facebook.com/TheAntiquesBoutique*
> > > >>> View our Ceramic Restoration Photos
> > > >>> <https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.398988066799604.100100.108554399176307&type=1&l=cd560aff9f>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > Richard Liveth Yet!
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>