BBC Radio 4 "Today" programme
BBC Radio 4 "Today" programme
2013-02-04 07:56:14
John A-H has just been interviewed. He hasn't yet heard the results of the DNA tests but HAS seen the facial reconstruction. He says it a "a very good likeness" and he is pretty confident.
I'm still wondering if the DNA result is not is not 100% positive.
Pat
________________________________
From: "" <richardiiiso>
To:
Sent: Monday, 4 February 2013, 3:07
Subject: Digest Number 3350
Richard III Society Forum - Discussion area for 15th 16th century history
Richard III Society Forum - Discussion area for 15th 16th century history Group
15 New Messages
Digest #3350
1a
Re: A different portrait of Edward IV by "Pamela Bain" pammybain78232
1b
Re: A different portrait of Edward IV by "Karen Clark" reswallie_girl
1c
Re: A different portrait of Edward IV by "Ishita Bandyo" ishitart
2a
Re: re skull by "Pamela Bain" pammybain78232
2b
Re: re skull by "wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
2c
Re: re skull by "wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
2d
Re: re skull by "Vickie" lolettecook
2e
Re: re skull by "Maria Torres" ejbronte_11210
2f
Re: re skull by "George Butterfield" gbutterf1
2g
Re: re skull by "Johanne Tournier" jltournier1
2h
re skull by "Carol Darling" cdarlingart1
3a
Re: BBC News Skull picture by "Pamela Bain" pammybain78232
3b
Re: BBC News Skull picture by "wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
3c
Re: BBC News Skull picture by "wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
3d
Re: BBC News Skull picture by "Ishita Bandyo" ishitart
Messages
1a
Re: A different portrait of Edward IV
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:28 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Pamela Bain" pammybain78232
And remember, 600 years ago, people died young. They lived hard lives, and probably 50 was considered elderly.
On Feb 3, 2013, at 6:31 PM, "justcarol67&q uot; justcarol67@ yahoo.comjustcarol67@ yahoo.com>> wrote:
Ishita Bandyo wrote:
>
> http://flickriver. com/search/ George+Plantagen et+/
> Also this has the pic of the skeleton remains in a glass box that we talked about( thanks to Vermeer 2 who has been thankfully absent from the forum!)
> If the portrait is of Ed, it has remarkable likeness to R. Poor Richard has been made to look about 50 years old!!!
Carol responds:
If you click on the link, you can find the provenance of this particular portrait, which dates to about 1580 or later. http://flickriver. com/photos/ 60861613@ N00/3473317431/
My theory is that the aging of Richard in his portraits is part of the process of making him appear more sinister in each successive copy and derives at least in part from Sir Thomas More's misstatement of Edward IV's age at death as fifty-two rather than not quite forty-one. The reader who doesn't know better might assume that Richard was only two years or so younger than Edward, with George in between. Whatever the case, if you look at the extant "portraits&quo t; in the order they were painted, you can see that Richard is about seventy by the time the artists have finished their distortions. Take a look at these portraits from the National Portrait Gallery, by no means the only extant portraits of Richard, but they give you some idea what More and Shakespeare did to Richard in the popular imagination:
http://www.npg. org.uk/collectio ns/search/ person.php? sort=dateAsc&Lin kID=mp03765&sear ch=sas&sText= Richard+III
If nothing else, the facial reconstruction should clear away any misconceptions about his age!
Carol
Carol
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1b
Re: A different portrait of Edward IV
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:55 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Karen Clark" reswallie_girl
The Duke of York was in his fifties, and Salisbury 60, when they fought
their final battle, and there were other 'old' soldiers. I think this is a
myth. People died younger than we do now from diseases and infections we
can cure. They didn't die younger of 'old age', if you know what I mean.
Commissions of Array called up men 'between 16 and 60', and plenty of
people (though not nearly as many as today) lived to their 70s. Huge
responsibility and the stress of running a country often makes leaders and
rulers look older than their years and Richard had great stress during his
reign. That may be why his portraits make him look a little older than his
early 30s.
Karen
On 4/02/13 1:28 PM, "Pamela Bain" pbain@...> wrote:
>And remember, 600 years ago, people died young. They lived hard lives,
>and probably 50 was considered elderly.
>
>On Feb 3, 2013, at 6:31 PM, "justcarol67&q uot;
>justcarol67@ yahoo.comjustcarol67@ yahoo.com>> wrote:
>
>
>
>Ishita Bandyo wrote:
>>
>> http://flickriver. com/search/ George+Plantagen et+/
>> Also this has the pic of the skeleton remains in a glass box that we
>>talked about( thanks to Vermeer 2 who has been thankfully absent from
>>the forum!)
>> If the portrait is of Ed, it has remarkable likeness to R. Poor Richard
>>has been made to look about 50 years old!!!
>
>Carol responds:
>
>If you click on the link, you can find the provenance of this particular
>portrait, which dates to about 1580 or later.
>http://flickriver. com/photos/ 60861613@ N00/3473317431/
>My theory is that the aging of Richard in his portraits is part of the
>process of making him appear more sinister in each successive copy and
>derives at least in part from Sir Thomas More's misstatement of Edward
>IV's age at death as fifty-two rather than not quite forty-one. The
>reader who doesn't know better might assume that Richard was only two
>years or so younger than Edward, with George in between. Whatever the
>case, if you look at the extant "portraits&quo t; in the order they were
>painted, you can see that Richard is about seventy by the time the
>artists have finished their distortions. Take a look at these portraits
>from the National Portrait Gallery, by no means the only extant portraits
>of Richard, but they give you some idea what More and Shakespeare did to
>Richard in the popular imagination:
>
>http://www.npg. org.uk/collectio ns/search/ person.php? sort=dateAsc&Lin kID=mp
>03765&search= sas&sText= Richard+III
>
>If nothing else, the facial reconstruction should clear away any
>misconceptions about his age!
>
>Carol
>
>Carol
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>-------- --------- --------- --------- -
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
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1c
Re: A different portrait of Edward IV
Sun Feb 3, 2013 7:07 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Ishita Bandyo" ishitart
Ah, at least 20 years older! The antiquarian portrait looks about mid thirties. I can make peace with that one!
Sent from my iPad
On Feb 3, 2013, at 9:55 PM, Karen Clark Ragged_staff@ bigpond.com> wrote:
> The Duke of York was in his fifties, and Salisbury 60, when they fought
> their final battle, and there were other 'old' soldiers. I think this is a
> myth. People died younger than we do now from diseases and infections we
> can cure. They didn't die younger of 'old age', if you know what I mean.
> Commissions of Array called up men 'between 16 and 60', and plenty of
> people (though not nearly as many as today) lived to their 70s. Huge
> responsibility and the stress of running a country often makes leaders and
> rulers look older than their years and Richard had great stress during his
> reign. That may be why his portraits make him look a little older than his
> early 30s.
>
> Karen
>
> On 4/02/13 1:28 PM, "Pamela Bain" pbain@...> wrote:
>
> >And remember, 600 years ago, people died young. They lived hard lives,
> >and probably 50 was considered elderly.
> >
> >On Feb 3, 2013, at 6:31 PM, "justcarol67&q uot;
> >justcarol67@ yahoo.comjustcar ol67@...> > wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >Ishita Bandyo wrote:
> >>
> >> http://flickriver. com/search/ George+Plantagen et+/
> >> Also this has the pic of the skeleton remains in a glass box that we
> >>talked about( thanks to Vermeer 2 who has been thankfully absent from
> >>the forum!)
> >> If the portrait is of Ed, it has remarkable likeness to R. Poor Richard
> >>has been made to look about 50 years old!!!
> >
> >Carol responds:
> >
> >If you click on the link, you can find the provenance of this particular
> >portrait, which dates to about 1580 or later.
> >http://flickriver. com/photos/ 60861613@ N00/3473317431/
> >My theory is that the aging of Richard in his portraits is part of the
> >process of making him appear more sinister in each successive copy and
> >derives at least in part from Sir Thomas More's misstatement of Edward
> >IV's age at death as fifty-two rather than not quite forty-one. The
> >reader who doesn't know better might assume that Richard was only two
> >years or so younger than Edward, with George in between. Whatever the
> >case, if you look at the extant "portraits&quo t; in the order they were
> >painted, you can see that Richard is about seventy by the time the
> >artists have finished their distortions. Take a look at these portraits
> >from the National Portrait Gallery, by no means the only extant portraits
> >of Richard, but they give you some idea what More and Shakespeare did to
> >Richard in the popular imagination:
> >
> >http://www.npg. org.uk/collectio ns/search/ person.php? sort=dateAsc&Lin kID=mp
> >03765&search= sas&sText= Richard+III
> >
> >If nothing else, the facial reconstruction should clear away any
> >misconceptions about his age!
> >
> >Carol
> >
> >Carol
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >-------- --------- --------- --------- -
> >
> >Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>
>
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2a
Re: re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:34 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Pamela Bain" pammybain78232
What a lovely post. Yes, a skull is sad to see, but also gratifying. Yes, obviously he suffered, but also yes, that many teeth and in that condition means good nutrition and good care during his lifetime.
On Feb 3, 2013, at 8:02 PM, "Carol Darling" cdarlingart1@ mac.com> wrote:
> Re skull&.I feel so privileged almost beyond words. Decades of wishing for some kind of connection to this man I admired and wanted to help to improve his historical record. Here he is and we can make this contact because of the indescribable determination of several like minded people. Being able to view his remains is the most incredible gift. This is one of the greatest and unique moments in my life, and Im glad I share it with so many very worthy people. We have so much more to do, but as always we go willingly, and with new fire. Thank you dear fates, you have been kind to us. Carol D.
>
> ------------ --------- --------- ------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
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2b
Re: re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:36 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
Maybe we need to be careful (me included!) 'cause we don't know yet if this skull was truly Richard' s or not. Paul's going get on us if we're not careful.
~Weds
--- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Ishita Bandyo wrote:
>
> Glad to be able to share this with you all!
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Feb 3, 2013, at 9:16 PM, Johanne Tournier wrote:
>
> > Hear hear! I would like to raise a glass in salute to the visionaries of the past and the present.
> > Johanne
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> >
> > From: mcjohn_wt_net
> > Sent: 4 Feb 2013 02:12:57 GMT
> > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > Subject: Re: re skull
> >
> > It seems a special responsibility to those of us who are here now to see it. So many labored so long, and didn't survive to see this day. Carrying on the work they did with dedication seems like the best tribute to those who kept the embers aglow: Dr. Buck, Walpole, Dr. Kendall, the Suttons, Dr. Visser-Fuchs, Dr. Horrox, Ms. Mackintosh, and so many others.
> >
> > Three cheers for Philippa Langley, John Ashdown-Hill, and Annette Carson! The latest warriors in Richard' s army, fighting a new type of battle!
> >
> > --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Johanne Tournier wrote:
> > >
> > > That's beautiful, Carol. It is wonderful to be able to share this with you all.
> > > I feel chills.
> > > Loyaulte me lie,
> > > Johanne
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > >
> > > From: Carol Darling
> > > Sent: 4 Feb 2013 02:02:22 GMT
> > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > Subject: re skull
> > >
> > > Re skullââ¬Â¦.I feel so privileged almost beyond words. Decades of wishing for some kind of connection to this man I admired and wanted to help to improve his historical record. Here he is and we can make this contact because of the indescribable determination of several like minded people. Being able to view his remains is the most incredible gift. This is one of the greatest and unique moments in my life, and Im glad I share it with so many very worthy people. We have so much more to do, but as always we go willingly, and with new fire. Thank you dear fates, you have been kind to us. Carol D.
> > >
> > > ------------ --------- --------- ------
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
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2c
Re: re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:44 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
So when was the front tooth lost, I wonder.
Am also wondering if he lost his bottom back molars from grinding and cracking them.
Am also wishing my imagination would shut up now.
~Weds
--- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Pamela Bain wrote:
>
> What a lovely post. Yes, a skull is sad to see, but also gratifying. Yes, obviously he suffered, but also yes, that many teeth and in that condition means good nutrition and good care during his lifetime.
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2d
Re: re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:46 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Vickie" lolettecook
I think they removed a tooth for DNA testing, but don't know which one
Vickie
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 3, 2013, at 8:44 PM, "wednesday_ mc" wednesday.mac@ gmail.com> wrote:
> So when was the front tooth lost, I wonder.
>
> Am also wondering if he lost his bottom back molars from grinding and cracking them.
>
> Am also wishing my imagination would shut up now.
>
> ~Weds
>
> --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Pamela Bain wrote:
> >
> > What a lovely post. Yes, a skull is sad to see, but also gratifying. Yes, obviously he suffered, but also yes, that many teeth and in that condition means good nutrition and good care during his lifetime.
>
>
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2e
Re: re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:55 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Maria Torres" ejbronte_11210
I was also impressed with the number and condition of the teeth -
particularly when I recall Townsend Miller, in _Castles and the Crown_,
when reporting on contemporary descriptions of Philip the Handsome, noted
that one of Philip's only flaws was bad teeth.
Also, am I wrong in thinking that the lower part of the face is very
strongly-defined?
Maria
ejbronte@gmail. com
On Sun, Feb 3, 2013 at 9:44 PM, wednesday_mc wednesday.mac@ gmail.com>wrote:
> **
>
>
> So when was the front tooth lost, I wonder.
>
> Am also wondering if he lost his bottom back molars from grinding and
> cracking them.
>
> Am also wishing my imagination would shut up now.
>
> ~Weds
>
>
> --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Pamela Bain wrote:
> >
> > What a lovely post. Yes, a skull is sad to see, but also gratifying.
> Yes, obviously he suffered, but also yes, that many teeth and in that
> condition means good nutrition and good care during his lifetime.
>
>
>
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2f
Re: re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:57 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"George Butterfield" gbutterf1
More than likely a molar as they have more material
G
Sent from my iPad
On Feb 3, 2013, at 9:46 PM, Vickie lolettecook@ yahoo.com> wrote:
> I think they removed a tooth for DNA testing, but don't know which one
> Vickie
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 3, 2013, at 8:44 PM, "wednesday_ mc" wednesday.mac@ gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > So when was the front tooth lost, I wonder.
> >
> > Am also wondering if he lost his bottom back molars from grinding and cracking them.
> >
> > Am also wishing my imagination would shut up now.
> >
> > ~Weds
> >
> > --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Pamela Bain wrote:
> > >
> > > What a lovely post. Yes, a skull is sad to see, but also gratifying. Yes, obviously he suffered, but also yes, that many teeth and in that condition means good nutrition and good care during his lifetime.
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
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2g
Re: re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 7:06 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Johanne Tournier" jltournier1
Hi, Maria -
Yes, I agree with you, and someone else here noted the strong jaw. In fact, this is the first time I can ever recall thinking a skull looked handsome. And yes the teeth are remarkable. Better than mine, lol, with the exception only of the missing ones I guess.
WOW!
Johanne
-----Original Message-----
From: Maria Torres
Sent: 4 Feb 2013 02:55:57 GMT
To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: re skull
I was also impressed with the number and condition of the teeth -
particularly when I recall Townsend Miller, in _Castles and the Crown_,
when reporting on contemporary descriptions of Philip the Handsome, noted
that one of Philip's only flaws was bad teeth.
Also, am I wrong in thinking that the lower part of the face is very
strongly-defined?
Maria
ejbronte@gmail. com
On Sun, Feb 3, 2013 at 9:44 PM, wednesday_mc wednesday.mac@ gmail.com>wrote:
> **
>
>
> So when was the front tooth lost, I wonder.
>
> Am also wondering if he lost his bottom back molars from grinding and
> cracking them.
>
> Am also wishing my imagination would shut up now.
>
> ~Weds
>
>
> --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Pamela Bain wrote:
> >
> > What a lovely post. Yes, a skull is sad to see, but also gratifying.
> Yes, obviously he suffered, but also yes, that many teeth and in that
> condition means good nutrition and good care during his lifetime.
>
>
>
------------ --------- --------- ------
Yahoo! Groups Links
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2h
re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 7:06 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Carol Darling" cdarlingart1
Re to Ishita: As an artist specializing in portraits, my first reaction to seeing the skull was&.wow what a strong jaw! Then I noticed the strong beginning arch to his nasal bridge, and sat watching Downton Abbey while fingering my own nasal skull junction, for comparison. I also checked out the brow ridges, and large eye sockets. Then I slipped into that strange world where we artists live&our imaginations, and began enjoying imagining how he looked alive. Our other Forum member Ishita I noticed, also reacted in a similar way. Well, it looks like our various projects are already starting&..Tomorrow will be a brighter day, lets get on with it! Carol D.
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3a
Re: BBC News Skull picture
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:36 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Pamela Bain" pammybain78232
My York ancestors also had that's traitor nose and strong jaw.......maybe they were among the many "and many other children" !
Listen, I am quite serious. At some point, I think it would be super if we could arrange a trip for us in the UA to visit the UK and see what we can of the land of R3!
On Feb 3, 2013, at 8:24 PM, "Ishita Bandyo" bandyoi@yahoo. combandyoi@yahoo. com>> wrote:
All his portraits shows him with square jaws and strong nose...... At least the Tudor painters kept that part of his face true to fact......Whatever they might have done with the wrinkles.... .
Sent from my iPad
On Feb 3, 2013, at 9:17 PM, "wednesday_ mc" wednesday.mac@ gmail.com> wrote:
> A friend and I made plans weeks ago to walk a labyrinth tomorrow. I guess now I know why.
>
> After seeing the photo of his skull and how it's affected me, I think I'm going to wait until I get back to find out what you all say about the conference and the documentary. I have to be able to drive, not cry.
>
> But dang, the man had a strong jaw.
>
> ~Weds
>
> --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Ishita Bandyo wrote:
> >
> > Here it is: http://www.archaeol ogy.co.uk/ articles/ news/is-this- the-skull- of-richard- iii.htm
> > Why did I feel so sad?!!!
>
>
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3b
Re: BBC News Skull picture
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:39 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
In an article I read on the discovery and analyses of the Towton archers/soldiers, one of the analysts remarked the teeth were exceptionally strong and in good condition generally because of the lack of sugar in people's diets back then.
What is that vertical mark in the middle of his forehead?
~Weds
--- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Vickie wrote:
>
> One thing I noticed is his teeth were on pretty good shape
> Vickie
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 3, 2013, at 7:25 PM, Ishita Bandyo wrote:
>
> > Here it is: http://www.archaeol ogy.co.uk/ articles/ news/is-this- the-skull- of-richard- iii.htm
> > Why did I feel so sad?!!!
> >
> > Sent from my iPad
> >
> > On Feb 3, 2013, at 8:18 PM, Karen Raynor karenraynor@ ...> wrote:
> >
> > > Bbc News website. Sorry I have no idea how to put url on here : (
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > >
> > > From: Karen Raynor
> > > Sent: 4 Feb 2013 01:13:07 GMT
> > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > Subject: Re: Re: Lin Foxhall' s disturbing comment ( Was: ... inconclusive DNA result?
> > >
> > > I heard it on local news so googled Leicester uni and there it is.
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > >
> > > From: Johanne Tournier
> > > Sent: 4 Feb 2013 01:09:54 GMT
> > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > Subject: Re: Re: Lin Foxhall' s disturbing comment ( Was: ... inconclusive DNA result?
> > >
> > > Quick, Karen, what's the URL?
> > > Johanne
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > >
> > > From: Karen Raynor
> > > Sent: 4 Feb 2013 01:06:08 GMT
> > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > Subject: Re: Re: Lin Foxhall' s disturbing comment ( Was: ... inconclusive DNA result?
> > >
> > > And so it begins....Leicester uni have released pics online of the skull......
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > >
> > > From: Johanne Tournier
> > > Sent: 3 Feb 2013 23:55:05 GMT
> > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > Subject: Re: Re: Lin Foxhall' s disturbing comment ( Was: ... inconclusive DNA result?
> > >
> > > Thanks, Lisa!
> > > I can't believe that it's less than 12 hrs away! Yippee!
> > > Johanne
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > >
> > > From: Lisa @ The Antiques Boutique
> > > Sent: 3 Feb 2013 23:34:25 GMT
> > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > Subject: Re: Re: Lin Foxhall' s disturbing comment ( Was: ... inconclusive DNA result?
> > >
> > > Hi Johanne
> > > its
> > > @uniofleicester https://twitter. com/uniofleicest er>
> > > & yes we are go at 6am here in Atlantic Canada - I'm going to go to
> > > http://www.bbc. co.uk/news/ uk/ for my updates & should be able to get the
> > > Chanel 4 program through my Apple TV/itunes app - I'll see if there is
> > > anyway I can copy it (dont have a recording device but I may be able to
> > > store it on my PC - will let you know)
> > >
> > > Looking forward to it all..
> > >
> > > Lisa
> > >
> > > On 3 February 2013 19:21, Johanne Tournier jltournier60@ ...> wrote:
> > >
> > > > **
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Hi, Kate -
> > > > Do you know what the unit's Twitter handle is?
> > > >
> > > > I think 10 am GMT is 6 am here in Atlantic Canada. I'll try to be online
> > > > fm then and have BBC on TV just on case. So I hope you lucky people will
> > > > keep us in mind & let us know when the press conference comes online.
> > > >
> > > > TTFN (smile)
> > > > Johanne
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > >
> > > > From: katewescombe
> > > > Sent: 3 Feb 2013 23:10:05 GMT
> > > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > > Subject: Re: Lin Foxhall' s disturbing comment
> > > > ( Was: ... inconclusive DNA result?
> > > >
> > > > There won't be any live audio or visual feeds from the press conference on
> > > > the university website although they will put a recording of the conference
> > > > online afterwards. During the conference the uni will be running a twitter
> > > > feed.
> > > >
> > > > Reading their notes for the press, provision is being made for satellite
> > > > trucks so I guess some channels may run the conference live - I think I've
> > > > read it will be shown on the BBC website.
> > > >
> > > > For those interested in the bone and site reports, details of how to get
> > > > hold of these will be on the Leicester website after the press briefing
> > > > tomorrow (pers. com. Richard Buckley).
> > > >
> > > > To tomorrow.
> > > >
> > > > Kate
> > > >
> > > > --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, eileen bates wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Ok...look... if there is going to be a live news conference on the
> > > > Leicester University website...I will watch and post at the same time...I
> > > > think someone..Liz? ..said that it was going to start about 10.30 and she
> > > > was hoping to be able to watch it...Eileen
> > > > > On 3 Feb 2013, at 20:56, Pamela Bain wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > But rich, with friends in the UK, who keep us ââ¬ËSin the knowâ⬠!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __
> > > > > > From: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com [mailto:
> > > > richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Ishita Bandyo
> > > > > > Sent: Sunday, February 03, 2013 2:54 PM
> > > > > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > > > > Subject: Re: Re: Lin Foxhall' s disturbing
> > > > comment ( Was: ... inconclusive DNA result?
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Too many of those fools out there!
> > > > > > Please let us in US know how it goes as soon you guys find out. We are
> > > > feeling like poor cousins out here:)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Ishita Bandyo
> > > > > > www.ishitabandyo. com
> > > > > > www.facebook. com/ishitabandyo finearts
> > > > > > www.ishitabandyoart s.blogspot. com
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Lisa
> > > The Antiques Boutique & Ceramic Restoration/ Conservation Services
> > > Baddeck, Nova Scotia.
> > > Tel: 902 295 9013 / 1329
> > >
> > > www.Antiques- Boutique. com http://www.antiques -boutique. com/>
> > > Like us on *www.facebook. com/TheAntiquesB outique*
> > > View our Ceramic Restoration Photos
> > > https://www. facebook. com/media/ set/?set= a.39898806679960 4.100100. 108554399176307& type=1&l= cd560aff9f>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------ --------- --------- ------
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
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3c
Re: BBC News Skull picture
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:41 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
::looks at Ravens score::
::looks at Greyfriars Warrior' s skull::
::remembers myriad mythologies regarding ravens being messengers from the Underworld/Otherwor ld::
That's just...neat.
~Weds
--- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, George Butterfield wrote:
>
> All this and the Superbowl I am going cross eyed
> G
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3d
Re: BBC News Skull picture
Sun Feb 3, 2013 7:04 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Ishita Bandyo" ishitart
I would love that! Only I don't have any money on my artist's salary!
Sent from my iPad
On Feb 3, 2013, at 9:36 PM, Pamela Bain pbain@...> wrote:
> My York ancestors also had that's traitor nose and strong jaw.......maybe they were among the many "and many other children" !
> Listen, I am quite serious. At some point, I think it would be super if we could arrange a trip for us in the UA to visit the UK and see what we can of the land of R3!
>
> On Feb 3, 2013, at 8:24 PM, "Ishita Bandyo" bandyoi@yahoo. combandyoi@yahoo. com>> wrote:
>
>
>
> All his portraits shows him with square jaws and strong nose...... At least the Tudor painters kept that part of his face true to fact......Whatever they might have done with the wrinkles.... .
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Feb 3, 2013, at 9:17 PM, "wednesday_ mc" wednesday.mac@ gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> A friend and I made plans weeks ago to walk a labyrinth tomorrow. I guess now I know why.
>>
>> After seeing the photo of his skull and how it's affected me, I think I'm going to wait until I get back to find out what you all say about the conference and the documentary. I have to be able to drive, not cry.
>>
>> But dang, the man had a strong jaw.
>>
>> ~Weds
>>
>> --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Ishita Bandyo wrote:
>>>
>>> Here it is: http://www.archaeol ogy.co.uk/ articles/ news/is-this- the-skull- of-richard- iii.htm
>>> Why did I feel so sad?!!!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------ --------- --------- ------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
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I'm still wondering if the DNA result is not is not 100% positive.
Pat
________________________________
From: "" <richardiiiso>
To:
Sent: Monday, 4 February 2013, 3:07
Subject: Digest Number 3350
Richard III Society Forum - Discussion area for 15th 16th century history
Richard III Society Forum - Discussion area for 15th 16th century history Group
15 New Messages
Digest #3350
1a
Re: A different portrait of Edward IV by "Pamela Bain" pammybain78232
1b
Re: A different portrait of Edward IV by "Karen Clark" reswallie_girl
1c
Re: A different portrait of Edward IV by "Ishita Bandyo" ishitart
2a
Re: re skull by "Pamela Bain" pammybain78232
2b
Re: re skull by "wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
2c
Re: re skull by "wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
2d
Re: re skull by "Vickie" lolettecook
2e
Re: re skull by "Maria Torres" ejbronte_11210
2f
Re: re skull by "George Butterfield" gbutterf1
2g
Re: re skull by "Johanne Tournier" jltournier1
2h
re skull by "Carol Darling" cdarlingart1
3a
Re: BBC News Skull picture by "Pamela Bain" pammybain78232
3b
Re: BBC News Skull picture by "wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
3c
Re: BBC News Skull picture by "wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
3d
Re: BBC News Skull picture by "Ishita Bandyo" ishitart
Messages
1a
Re: A different portrait of Edward IV
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:28 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Pamela Bain" pammybain78232
And remember, 600 years ago, people died young. They lived hard lives, and probably 50 was considered elderly.
On Feb 3, 2013, at 6:31 PM, "justcarol67&q uot; justcarol67@ yahoo.comjustcarol67@ yahoo.com>> wrote:
Ishita Bandyo wrote:
>
> http://flickriver. com/search/ George+Plantagen et+/
> Also this has the pic of the skeleton remains in a glass box that we talked about( thanks to Vermeer 2 who has been thankfully absent from the forum!)
> If the portrait is of Ed, it has remarkable likeness to R. Poor Richard has been made to look about 50 years old!!!
Carol responds:
If you click on the link, you can find the provenance of this particular portrait, which dates to about 1580 or later. http://flickriver. com/photos/ 60861613@ N00/3473317431/
My theory is that the aging of Richard in his portraits is part of the process of making him appear more sinister in each successive copy and derives at least in part from Sir Thomas More's misstatement of Edward IV's age at death as fifty-two rather than not quite forty-one. The reader who doesn't know better might assume that Richard was only two years or so younger than Edward, with George in between. Whatever the case, if you look at the extant "portraits&quo t; in the order they were painted, you can see that Richard is about seventy by the time the artists have finished their distortions. Take a look at these portraits from the National Portrait Gallery, by no means the only extant portraits of Richard, but they give you some idea what More and Shakespeare did to Richard in the popular imagination:
http://www.npg. org.uk/collectio ns/search/ person.php? sort=dateAsc&Lin kID=mp03765&sear ch=sas&sText= Richard+III
If nothing else, the facial reconstruction should clear away any misconceptions about his age!
Carol
Carol
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1b
Re: A different portrait of Edward IV
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:55 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Karen Clark" reswallie_girl
The Duke of York was in his fifties, and Salisbury 60, when they fought
their final battle, and there were other 'old' soldiers. I think this is a
myth. People died younger than we do now from diseases and infections we
can cure. They didn't die younger of 'old age', if you know what I mean.
Commissions of Array called up men 'between 16 and 60', and plenty of
people (though not nearly as many as today) lived to their 70s. Huge
responsibility and the stress of running a country often makes leaders and
rulers look older than their years and Richard had great stress during his
reign. That may be why his portraits make him look a little older than his
early 30s.
Karen
On 4/02/13 1:28 PM, "Pamela Bain" pbain@...> wrote:
>And remember, 600 years ago, people died young. They lived hard lives,
>and probably 50 was considered elderly.
>
>On Feb 3, 2013, at 6:31 PM, "justcarol67&q uot;
>justcarol67@ yahoo.comjustcarol67@ yahoo.com>> wrote:
>
>
>
>Ishita Bandyo wrote:
>>
>> http://flickriver. com/search/ George+Plantagen et+/
>> Also this has the pic of the skeleton remains in a glass box that we
>>talked about( thanks to Vermeer 2 who has been thankfully absent from
>>the forum!)
>> If the portrait is of Ed, it has remarkable likeness to R. Poor Richard
>>has been made to look about 50 years old!!!
>
>Carol responds:
>
>If you click on the link, you can find the provenance of this particular
>portrait, which dates to about 1580 or later.
>http://flickriver. com/photos/ 60861613@ N00/3473317431/
>My theory is that the aging of Richard in his portraits is part of the
>process of making him appear more sinister in each successive copy and
>derives at least in part from Sir Thomas More's misstatement of Edward
>IV's age at death as fifty-two rather than not quite forty-one. The
>reader who doesn't know better might assume that Richard was only two
>years or so younger than Edward, with George in between. Whatever the
>case, if you look at the extant "portraits&quo t; in the order they were
>painted, you can see that Richard is about seventy by the time the
>artists have finished their distortions. Take a look at these portraits
>from the National Portrait Gallery, by no means the only extant portraits
>of Richard, but they give you some idea what More and Shakespeare did to
>Richard in the popular imagination:
>
>http://www.npg. org.uk/collectio ns/search/ person.php? sort=dateAsc&Lin kID=mp
>03765&search= sas&sText= Richard+III
>
>If nothing else, the facial reconstruction should clear away any
>misconceptions about his age!
>
>Carol
>
>Carol
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>-------- --------- --------- --------- -
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
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1c
Re: A different portrait of Edward IV
Sun Feb 3, 2013 7:07 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Ishita Bandyo" ishitart
Ah, at least 20 years older! The antiquarian portrait looks about mid thirties. I can make peace with that one!
Sent from my iPad
On Feb 3, 2013, at 9:55 PM, Karen Clark Ragged_staff@ bigpond.com> wrote:
> The Duke of York was in his fifties, and Salisbury 60, when they fought
> their final battle, and there were other 'old' soldiers. I think this is a
> myth. People died younger than we do now from diseases and infections we
> can cure. They didn't die younger of 'old age', if you know what I mean.
> Commissions of Array called up men 'between 16 and 60', and plenty of
> people (though not nearly as many as today) lived to their 70s. Huge
> responsibility and the stress of running a country often makes leaders and
> rulers look older than their years and Richard had great stress during his
> reign. That may be why his portraits make him look a little older than his
> early 30s.
>
> Karen
>
> On 4/02/13 1:28 PM, "Pamela Bain" pbain@...> wrote:
>
> >And remember, 600 years ago, people died young. They lived hard lives,
> >and probably 50 was considered elderly.
> >
> >On Feb 3, 2013, at 6:31 PM, "justcarol67&q uot;
> >justcarol67@ yahoo.comjustcar ol67@...> > wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >Ishita Bandyo wrote:
> >>
> >> http://flickriver. com/search/ George+Plantagen et+/
> >> Also this has the pic of the skeleton remains in a glass box that we
> >>talked about( thanks to Vermeer 2 who has been thankfully absent from
> >>the forum!)
> >> If the portrait is of Ed, it has remarkable likeness to R. Poor Richard
> >>has been made to look about 50 years old!!!
> >
> >Carol responds:
> >
> >If you click on the link, you can find the provenance of this particular
> >portrait, which dates to about 1580 or later.
> >http://flickriver. com/photos/ 60861613@ N00/3473317431/
> >My theory is that the aging of Richard in his portraits is part of the
> >process of making him appear more sinister in each successive copy and
> >derives at least in part from Sir Thomas More's misstatement of Edward
> >IV's age at death as fifty-two rather than not quite forty-one. The
> >reader who doesn't know better might assume that Richard was only two
> >years or so younger than Edward, with George in between. Whatever the
> >case, if you look at the extant "portraits&quo t; in the order they were
> >painted, you can see that Richard is about seventy by the time the
> >artists have finished their distortions. Take a look at these portraits
> >from the National Portrait Gallery, by no means the only extant portraits
> >of Richard, but they give you some idea what More and Shakespeare did to
> >Richard in the popular imagination:
> >
> >http://www.npg. org.uk/collectio ns/search/ person.php? sort=dateAsc&Lin kID=mp
> >03765&search= sas&sText= Richard+III
> >
> >If nothing else, the facial reconstruction should clear away any
> >misconceptions about his age!
> >
> >Carol
> >
> >Carol
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >-------- --------- --------- --------- -
> >
> >Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>
>
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2a
Re: re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:34 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Pamela Bain" pammybain78232
What a lovely post. Yes, a skull is sad to see, but also gratifying. Yes, obviously he suffered, but also yes, that many teeth and in that condition means good nutrition and good care during his lifetime.
On Feb 3, 2013, at 8:02 PM, "Carol Darling" cdarlingart1@ mac.com> wrote:
> Re skull&.I feel so privileged almost beyond words. Decades of wishing for some kind of connection to this man I admired and wanted to help to improve his historical record. Here he is and we can make this contact because of the indescribable determination of several like minded people. Being able to view his remains is the most incredible gift. This is one of the greatest and unique moments in my life, and Im glad I share it with so many very worthy people. We have so much more to do, but as always we go willingly, and with new fire. Thank you dear fates, you have been kind to us. Carol D.
>
> ------------ --------- --------- ------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
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2b
Re: re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:36 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
Maybe we need to be careful (me included!) 'cause we don't know yet if this skull was truly Richard' s or not. Paul's going get on us if we're not careful.
~Weds
--- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Ishita Bandyo wrote:
>
> Glad to be able to share this with you all!
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Feb 3, 2013, at 9:16 PM, Johanne Tournier wrote:
>
> > Hear hear! I would like to raise a glass in salute to the visionaries of the past and the present.
> > Johanne
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> >
> > From: mcjohn_wt_net
> > Sent: 4 Feb 2013 02:12:57 GMT
> > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > Subject: Re: re skull
> >
> > It seems a special responsibility to those of us who are here now to see it. So many labored so long, and didn't survive to see this day. Carrying on the work they did with dedication seems like the best tribute to those who kept the embers aglow: Dr. Buck, Walpole, Dr. Kendall, the Suttons, Dr. Visser-Fuchs, Dr. Horrox, Ms. Mackintosh, and so many others.
> >
> > Three cheers for Philippa Langley, John Ashdown-Hill, and Annette Carson! The latest warriors in Richard' s army, fighting a new type of battle!
> >
> > --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Johanne Tournier wrote:
> > >
> > > That's beautiful, Carol. It is wonderful to be able to share this with you all.
> > > I feel chills.
> > > Loyaulte me lie,
> > > Johanne
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > >
> > > From: Carol Darling
> > > Sent: 4 Feb 2013 02:02:22 GMT
> > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > Subject: re skull
> > >
> > > Re skullââ¬Â¦.I feel so privileged almost beyond words. Decades of wishing for some kind of connection to this man I admired and wanted to help to improve his historical record. Here he is and we can make this contact because of the indescribable determination of several like minded people. Being able to view his remains is the most incredible gift. This is one of the greatest and unique moments in my life, and Im glad I share it with so many very worthy people. We have so much more to do, but as always we go willingly, and with new fire. Thank you dear fates, you have been kind to us. Carol D.
> > >
> > > ------------ --------- --------- ------
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
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2c
Re: re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:44 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
So when was the front tooth lost, I wonder.
Am also wondering if he lost his bottom back molars from grinding and cracking them.
Am also wishing my imagination would shut up now.
~Weds
--- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Pamela Bain wrote:
>
> What a lovely post. Yes, a skull is sad to see, but also gratifying. Yes, obviously he suffered, but also yes, that many teeth and in that condition means good nutrition and good care during his lifetime.
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2d
Re: re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:46 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Vickie" lolettecook
I think they removed a tooth for DNA testing, but don't know which one
Vickie
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 3, 2013, at 8:44 PM, "wednesday_ mc" wednesday.mac@ gmail.com> wrote:
> So when was the front tooth lost, I wonder.
>
> Am also wondering if he lost his bottom back molars from grinding and cracking them.
>
> Am also wishing my imagination would shut up now.
>
> ~Weds
>
> --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Pamela Bain wrote:
> >
> > What a lovely post. Yes, a skull is sad to see, but also gratifying. Yes, obviously he suffered, but also yes, that many teeth and in that condition means good nutrition and good care during his lifetime.
>
>
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2e
Re: re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:55 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Maria Torres" ejbronte_11210
I was also impressed with the number and condition of the teeth -
particularly when I recall Townsend Miller, in _Castles and the Crown_,
when reporting on contemporary descriptions of Philip the Handsome, noted
that one of Philip's only flaws was bad teeth.
Also, am I wrong in thinking that the lower part of the face is very
strongly-defined?
Maria
ejbronte@gmail. com
On Sun, Feb 3, 2013 at 9:44 PM, wednesday_mc wednesday.mac@ gmail.com>wrote:
> **
>
>
> So when was the front tooth lost, I wonder.
>
> Am also wondering if he lost his bottom back molars from grinding and
> cracking them.
>
> Am also wishing my imagination would shut up now.
>
> ~Weds
>
>
> --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Pamela Bain wrote:
> >
> > What a lovely post. Yes, a skull is sad to see, but also gratifying.
> Yes, obviously he suffered, but also yes, that many teeth and in that
> condition means good nutrition and good care during his lifetime.
>
>
>
Reply to sender . Reply to group . Reply via Web Post . All Messages (15) . Top ^
2f
Re: re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:57 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"George Butterfield" gbutterf1
More than likely a molar as they have more material
G
Sent from my iPad
On Feb 3, 2013, at 9:46 PM, Vickie lolettecook@ yahoo.com> wrote:
> I think they removed a tooth for DNA testing, but don't know which one
> Vickie
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 3, 2013, at 8:44 PM, "wednesday_ mc" wednesday.mac@ gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > So when was the front tooth lost, I wonder.
> >
> > Am also wondering if he lost his bottom back molars from grinding and cracking them.
> >
> > Am also wishing my imagination would shut up now.
> >
> > ~Weds
> >
> > --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Pamela Bain wrote:
> > >
> > > What a lovely post. Yes, a skull is sad to see, but also gratifying. Yes, obviously he suffered, but also yes, that many teeth and in that condition means good nutrition and good care during his lifetime.
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
Reply to sender . Reply to group . Reply via Web Post . All Messages (15) . Top ^
2g
Re: re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 7:06 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Johanne Tournier" jltournier1
Hi, Maria -
Yes, I agree with you, and someone else here noted the strong jaw. In fact, this is the first time I can ever recall thinking a skull looked handsome. And yes the teeth are remarkable. Better than mine, lol, with the exception only of the missing ones I guess.
WOW!
Johanne
-----Original Message-----
From: Maria Torres
Sent: 4 Feb 2013 02:55:57 GMT
To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: re skull
I was also impressed with the number and condition of the teeth -
particularly when I recall Townsend Miller, in _Castles and the Crown_,
when reporting on contemporary descriptions of Philip the Handsome, noted
that one of Philip's only flaws was bad teeth.
Also, am I wrong in thinking that the lower part of the face is very
strongly-defined?
Maria
ejbronte@gmail. com
On Sun, Feb 3, 2013 at 9:44 PM, wednesday_mc wednesday.mac@ gmail.com>wrote:
> **
>
>
> So when was the front tooth lost, I wonder.
>
> Am also wondering if he lost his bottom back molars from grinding and
> cracking them.
>
> Am also wishing my imagination would shut up now.
>
> ~Weds
>
>
> --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Pamela Bain wrote:
> >
> > What a lovely post. Yes, a skull is sad to see, but also gratifying.
> Yes, obviously he suffered, but also yes, that many teeth and in that
> condition means good nutrition and good care during his lifetime.
>
>
>
------------ --------- --------- ------
Yahoo! Groups Links
Reply to sender . Reply to group . Reply via Web Post . All Messages (15) . Top ^
2h
re skull
Sun Feb 3, 2013 7:06 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Carol Darling" cdarlingart1
Re to Ishita: As an artist specializing in portraits, my first reaction to seeing the skull was&.wow what a strong jaw! Then I noticed the strong beginning arch to his nasal bridge, and sat watching Downton Abbey while fingering my own nasal skull junction, for comparison. I also checked out the brow ridges, and large eye sockets. Then I slipped into that strange world where we artists live&our imaginations, and began enjoying imagining how he looked alive. Our other Forum member Ishita I noticed, also reacted in a similar way. Well, it looks like our various projects are already starting&..Tomorrow will be a brighter day, lets get on with it! Carol D.
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3a
Re: BBC News Skull picture
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:36 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Pamela Bain" pammybain78232
My York ancestors also had that's traitor nose and strong jaw.......maybe they were among the many "and many other children" !
Listen, I am quite serious. At some point, I think it would be super if we could arrange a trip for us in the UA to visit the UK and see what we can of the land of R3!
On Feb 3, 2013, at 8:24 PM, "Ishita Bandyo" bandyoi@yahoo. combandyoi@yahoo. com>> wrote:
All his portraits shows him with square jaws and strong nose...... At least the Tudor painters kept that part of his face true to fact......Whatever they might have done with the wrinkles.... .
Sent from my iPad
On Feb 3, 2013, at 9:17 PM, "wednesday_ mc" wednesday.mac@ gmail.com> wrote:
> A friend and I made plans weeks ago to walk a labyrinth tomorrow. I guess now I know why.
>
> After seeing the photo of his skull and how it's affected me, I think I'm going to wait until I get back to find out what you all say about the conference and the documentary. I have to be able to drive, not cry.
>
> But dang, the man had a strong jaw.
>
> ~Weds
>
> --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Ishita Bandyo wrote:
> >
> > Here it is: http://www.archaeol ogy.co.uk/ articles/ news/is-this- the-skull- of-richard- iii.htm
> > Why did I feel so sad?!!!
>
>
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3b
Re: BBC News Skull picture
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:39 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
In an article I read on the discovery and analyses of the Towton archers/soldiers, one of the analysts remarked the teeth were exceptionally strong and in good condition generally because of the lack of sugar in people's diets back then.
What is that vertical mark in the middle of his forehead?
~Weds
--- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Vickie wrote:
>
> One thing I noticed is his teeth were on pretty good shape
> Vickie
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 3, 2013, at 7:25 PM, Ishita Bandyo wrote:
>
> > Here it is: http://www.archaeol ogy.co.uk/ articles/ news/is-this- the-skull- of-richard- iii.htm
> > Why did I feel so sad?!!!
> >
> > Sent from my iPad
> >
> > On Feb 3, 2013, at 8:18 PM, Karen Raynor karenraynor@ ...> wrote:
> >
> > > Bbc News website. Sorry I have no idea how to put url on here : (
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > >
> > > From: Karen Raynor
> > > Sent: 4 Feb 2013 01:13:07 GMT
> > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > Subject: Re: Re: Lin Foxhall' s disturbing comment ( Was: ... inconclusive DNA result?
> > >
> > > I heard it on local news so googled Leicester uni and there it is.
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > >
> > > From: Johanne Tournier
> > > Sent: 4 Feb 2013 01:09:54 GMT
> > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > Subject: Re: Re: Lin Foxhall' s disturbing comment ( Was: ... inconclusive DNA result?
> > >
> > > Quick, Karen, what's the URL?
> > > Johanne
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > >
> > > From: Karen Raynor
> > > Sent: 4 Feb 2013 01:06:08 GMT
> > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > Subject: Re: Re: Lin Foxhall' s disturbing comment ( Was: ... inconclusive DNA result?
> > >
> > > And so it begins....Leicester uni have released pics online of the skull......
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > >
> > > From: Johanne Tournier
> > > Sent: 3 Feb 2013 23:55:05 GMT
> > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > Subject: Re: Re: Lin Foxhall' s disturbing comment ( Was: ... inconclusive DNA result?
> > >
> > > Thanks, Lisa!
> > > I can't believe that it's less than 12 hrs away! Yippee!
> > > Johanne
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > >
> > > From: Lisa @ The Antiques Boutique
> > > Sent: 3 Feb 2013 23:34:25 GMT
> > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > Subject: Re: Re: Lin Foxhall' s disturbing comment ( Was: ... inconclusive DNA result?
> > >
> > > Hi Johanne
> > > its
> > > @uniofleicester https://twitter. com/uniofleicest er>
> > > & yes we are go at 6am here in Atlantic Canada - I'm going to go to
> > > http://www.bbc. co.uk/news/ uk/ for my updates & should be able to get the
> > > Chanel 4 program through my Apple TV/itunes app - I'll see if there is
> > > anyway I can copy it (dont have a recording device but I may be able to
> > > store it on my PC - will let you know)
> > >
> > > Looking forward to it all..
> > >
> > > Lisa
> > >
> > > On 3 February 2013 19:21, Johanne Tournier jltournier60@ ...> wrote:
> > >
> > > > **
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Hi, Kate -
> > > > Do you know what the unit's Twitter handle is?
> > > >
> > > > I think 10 am GMT is 6 am here in Atlantic Canada. I'll try to be online
> > > > fm then and have BBC on TV just on case. So I hope you lucky people will
> > > > keep us in mind & let us know when the press conference comes online.
> > > >
> > > > TTFN (smile)
> > > > Johanne
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > >
> > > > From: katewescombe
> > > > Sent: 3 Feb 2013 23:10:05 GMT
> > > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > > Subject: Re: Lin Foxhall' s disturbing comment
> > > > ( Was: ... inconclusive DNA result?
> > > >
> > > > There won't be any live audio or visual feeds from the press conference on
> > > > the university website although they will put a recording of the conference
> > > > online afterwards. During the conference the uni will be running a twitter
> > > > feed.
> > > >
> > > > Reading their notes for the press, provision is being made for satellite
> > > > trucks so I guess some channels may run the conference live - I think I've
> > > > read it will be shown on the BBC website.
> > > >
> > > > For those interested in the bone and site reports, details of how to get
> > > > hold of these will be on the Leicester website after the press briefing
> > > > tomorrow (pers. com. Richard Buckley).
> > > >
> > > > To tomorrow.
> > > >
> > > > Kate
> > > >
> > > > --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, eileen bates wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Ok...look... if there is going to be a live news conference on the
> > > > Leicester University website...I will watch and post at the same time...I
> > > > think someone..Liz? ..said that it was going to start about 10.30 and she
> > > > was hoping to be able to watch it...Eileen
> > > > > On 3 Feb 2013, at 20:56, Pamela Bain wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > But rich, with friends in the UK, who keep us ââ¬ËSin the knowâ⬠!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __
> > > > > > From: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com [mailto:
> > > > richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Ishita Bandyo
> > > > > > Sent: Sunday, February 03, 2013 2:54 PM
> > > > > > To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > > > > > Subject: Re: Re: Lin Foxhall' s disturbing
> > > > comment ( Was: ... inconclusive DNA result?
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Too many of those fools out there!
> > > > > > Please let us in US know how it goes as soon you guys find out. We are
> > > > feeling like poor cousins out here:)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Ishita Bandyo
> > > > > > www.ishitabandyo. com
> > > > > > www.facebook. com/ishitabandyo finearts
> > > > > > www.ishitabandyoart s.blogspot. com
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Lisa
> > > The Antiques Boutique & Ceramic Restoration/ Conservation Services
> > > Baddeck, Nova Scotia.
> > > Tel: 902 295 9013 / 1329
> > >
> > > www.Antiques- Boutique. com http://www.antiques -boutique. com/>
> > > Like us on *www.facebook. com/TheAntiquesB outique*
> > > View our Ceramic Restoration Photos
> > > https://www. facebook. com/media/ set/?set= a.39898806679960 4.100100. 108554399176307& type=1&l= cd560aff9f>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------ --------- --------- ------
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
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3c
Re: BBC News Skull picture
Sun Feb 3, 2013 6:41 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"wednesday_mc" wednesday_mc
::looks at Ravens score::
::looks at Greyfriars Warrior' s skull::
::remembers myriad mythologies regarding ravens being messengers from the Underworld/Otherwor ld::
That's just...neat.
~Weds
--- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, George Butterfield wrote:
>
> All this and the Superbowl I am going cross eyed
> G
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3d
Re: BBC News Skull picture
Sun Feb 3, 2013 7:04 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Ishita Bandyo" ishitart
I would love that! Only I don't have any money on my artist's salary!
Sent from my iPad
On Feb 3, 2013, at 9:36 PM, Pamela Bain pbain@...> wrote:
> My York ancestors also had that's traitor nose and strong jaw.......maybe they were among the many "and many other children" !
> Listen, I am quite serious. At some point, I think it would be super if we could arrange a trip for us in the UA to visit the UK and see what we can of the land of R3!
>
> On Feb 3, 2013, at 8:24 PM, "Ishita Bandyo" bandyoi@yahoo. combandyoi@yahoo. com>> wrote:
>
>
>
> All his portraits shows him with square jaws and strong nose...... At least the Tudor painters kept that part of his face true to fact......Whatever they might have done with the wrinkles.... .
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Feb 3, 2013, at 9:17 PM, "wednesday_ mc" wednesday.mac@ gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> A friend and I made plans weeks ago to walk a labyrinth tomorrow. I guess now I know why.
>>
>> After seeing the photo of his skull and how it's affected me, I think I'm going to wait until I get back to find out what you all say about the conference and the documentary. I have to be able to drive, not cry.
>>
>> But dang, the man had a strong jaw.
>>
>> ~Weds
>>
>> --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com, Ishita Bandyo wrote:
>>>
>>> Here it is: http://www.archaeol ogy.co.uk/ articles/ news/is-this- the-skull- of-richard- iii.htm
>>> Why did I feel so sad?!!!
>
>
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> ------------ --------- --------- ------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
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>
>
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