Richards accent

Re authentic accent for Richard: Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent? I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!! I had a thought&..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded? it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!! Im sure someone with computer graphics can come up with this for us. Carol D.

Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'

On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" <cdarlingart1@...> wrote:

> Re authentic accent for Richard: Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent? I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!! I had a thought&..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded? it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!! Im sure someone with computer graphics can come up with this for us. Carol D.
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

BISHOP STILLINGTON: Your Grace, I beg to inform that because your brother was precontracted to Eleanor Butler before his marriage to the current Queen, his current marriage is invalid and his children, particularly your nephews Edward and Richard, are ineligible to succeed to the throne.

RICHARD: Do whut, now?

--- In , Pamela Bain wrote:
>
> Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'
>
> On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" wrote:
>
> > Re authentic accent for Richard: Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent? I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!! I had a thought…..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded? it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!! Im sure someone with computer graphics can come up with this for us. Carol D.
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>

If it were northern Florida, it would have been:

RICHARD: Hush yer mouth.

If it were the Wild West, it would have been:

RICHARD: Dammit, I told him to keep his britches on. Let's dig 'im up and hang 'im!

And if it were Los Angeles, it would be:

RICHARD: WhatEVER.

~Weds


--- In , "mcjohn_wt_net" wrote:
>
> BISHOP STILLINGTON: Your Grace, I beg to inform that because your brother was precontracted to Eleanor Butler before his marriage to the current Queen, his current marriage is invalid and his children, particularly your nephews Edward and Richard, are ineligible to succeed to the throne.
>
> RICHARD: Do whut, now?
>
> --- In , Pamela Bain wrote:
> >
> > Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'
> >
> > On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" wrote:
> >
> > > Re authentic accent for Richard: Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent? I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!! I had a thought…..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded? it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!! Im sure someone with computer graphics can come up with this for us. Carol D.
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>

Oh Honey, I luv yoooou!!!! Honestly, I do not speak that slowly, I promise.

On Feb 7, 2013, at 7:50 PM, "mcjohn_wt_net" <mcjohn@...<mailto:mcjohn@...>> wrote:



BISHOP STILLINGTON: Your Grace, I beg to inform that because your brother was precontracted to Eleanor Butler before his marriage to the current Queen, his current marriage is invalid and his children, particularly your nephews Edward and Richard, are ineligible to succeed to the throne.

RICHARD: Do whut, now?

--- In <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Pamela Bain wrote:
>
> Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'
>
> On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" wrote:
>
> > Re authentic accent for Richard: Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent? I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!! I had a thoughtý..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded? it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!! Im sure someone with computer graphics can come up with this for us. Carol D.
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>

WhatEVER, duh! Love it, love it!

On Feb 7, 2013, at 8:06 PM, "wednesday_mc" <wednesday.mac@...<mailto:wednesday.mac@...>> wrote:



If it were northern Florida, it would have been:

RICHARD: Hush yer mouth.

If it were the Wild West, it would have been:

RICHARD: Dammit, I told him to keep his britches on. Let's dig 'im up and hang 'im!

And if it were Los Angeles, it would be:

RICHARD: WhatEVER.

~Weds

--- In <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, "mcjohn_wt_net" wrote:
>
> BISHOP STILLINGTON: Your Grace, I beg to inform that because your brother was precontracted to Eleanor Butler before his marriage to the current Queen, his current marriage is invalid and his children, particularly your nephews Edward and Richard, are ineligible to succeed to the throne.
>
> RICHARD: Do whut, now?
>
> --- In <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Pamela Bain wrote:
> >
> > Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'
> >
> > On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" wrote:
> >
> > > Re authentic accent for Richard: Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent? I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!! I had a thoughtý..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded? it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!! Im sure someone with computer graphics can come up with this for us. Carol D.
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>

Hello Pamela, I read this article re Richard's accent some time ago, it's not new and in my opinion not worth the paper it's written on.
Richard was brought up first of all at Fotheringhay for about 8 years which is not West Midlands, he would have spent some time in London and possibly Ludlow as life was very peripatetic for people of Richard's rank.
At the age of ten he went to Middleham for approximately four year so it is likely he would have picked up if not an accent, some of the way of speaking in North Yorks to be understood.
After that various places he visited for short periods like Wales would have little effect on his accent.
At 19 years he went back north and was there for approximately 12 years and would have picked up some of the accent, I know he used the language of the north as he used the word Kye ( not sure of the spelling), plural for cows in his letters ( can't remember where is read this but it is accurate). The person who thinks Richard had a west midlands accent has used very little evidence for his idea, I wonder if he lives in Leicester and is trying to make another argument for Richard staying in Leicester.
The accent for North Yorkshire is very strong and is so today, I'm a Yorkshire lass and I can't understand some of the words used.
Further argument for a slightly northern accent for Richard would be that he was brought up by two northerners, His mother born at Raby which is now in County Durham and his father born at Conisborough in South Yorks. Both his parents spent their young life together at Raby so both would have been exposed to the local accents.
I'm no expert on these matters I have to admit  but I believe Richard would have had a slightly northern lilt.
Loyaulte me Lie.
Christine


________________________________
From: Pamela Bain <pbain@...>
To: "<>" <>
Sent: Thursday, 7 February 2013, 22:06
Subject: Re: Richards accent

Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'

On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" <cdarlingart1@...> wrote:

> Re authentic accent for Richard:  Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent?  I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!!  I had a thought&..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded?  it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!!  Im sure someone with computer graphics  can come up with this for us.  Carol D.
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

A child picks up an accent from those around him or her. While the common people in Fotheringhay would have had medieval East Midlands accents, and the common people in Middleham would have had medieval Yorkshire accents, the main influence on the way Richard spoke would have been his family (both Nevilles and Plantagenets) and his attendants - including those teaching him Latin and martial skills - who could have come from other parts of the country. While he certainly would have needed to understand the Yorkshire dialect, that does not mean that he would have spoken it when conversing with other members of the nobility.

Listening to the Uni of Leicester recording I thought the speaker was giving the words in Richard's letter more of a Scottish lilt than a West Midlands one. I question just how far you can establish a speaker's accent from his written words anyway - after all, the same letter written in modern English read by a Yorkshireman, a Cockney, a Texan and a Pakistani would likely come out in four very different-sounding versions.

Richard G

--- In , C HOLMES wrote:
>
> Hello Pamela, I read this article re Richard's accent some time ago, it's not new and in my opinion not worth the paper it's written on.
> Richard was brought up first of all at Fotheringhay for about 8 years which is not West Midlands, he would have spent some time in London and possibly Ludlow as life was very peripatetic for people of Richard's rank.
> At the age of ten he went to Middleham for approximately four year so it is likely he would have picked up if not an accent, some of the way of speaking in North Yorks to be understood.
> After that various places he visited for short periods like Wales would have little effect on his accent.
> At 19 years he went back north and was there for approximately 12 years and would have picked up some of the accent, I know he used the language of the north as he used the word Kye ( not sure of the spelling), plural for cows in his letters ( can't remember where is read this but it is accurate). The person who thinks Richard had a west midlands accent has used very little evidence for his idea, I wonder if he lives in Leicester and is trying to make another argument for Richard staying in Leicester.
> The accent for North Yorkshire is very strong and is so today, I'm a Yorkshire lass and I can't understand some of the words used.
> Further argument for a slightly northern accent for Richard would be that he was brought up by two northerners, His mother born at Raby which is now in County Durham and his father born at Conisborough in South Yorks. Both his parents spent their young life together at Raby so both would have been exposed to the local accents.
> I'm no expert on these matters I have to admit  but I believe Richard would have had a slightly northern lilt.
> Loyaulte me Lie.
> Christine
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Pamela Bain
> To: " "
> Sent: Thursday, 7 February 2013, 22:06
> Subject: Re: Richards accent
>
> Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'
>
> On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" wrote:
>
> > Re authentic accent for Richard:  Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent?  I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!!  I had a thought…..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded?  it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!!  Im sure someone with computer graphics  can come up with this for us.  Carol D.
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>

I understood, though I could be wrong, that the way the words were spelled in the letters are an indication of the accent used.
Of course at that time, there wasn't a standard English spelling.
Jacq

To:
From: RSG_Corris@...
Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2013 11:01:53 +0000
Subject: Re: Richards accent


























A child picks up an accent from those around him or her. While the common people in Fotheringhay would have had medieval East Midlands accents, and the common people in Middleham would have had medieval Yorkshire accents, the main influence on the way Richard spoke would have been his family (both Nevilles and Plantagenets) and his attendants - including those teaching him Latin and martial skills - who could have come from other parts of the country. While he certainly would have needed to understand the Yorkshire dialect, that does not mean that he would have spoken it when conversing with other members of the nobility.



Listening to the Uni of Leicester recording I thought the speaker was giving the words in Richard's letter more of a Scottish lilt than a West Midlands one. I question just how far you can establish a speaker's accent from his written words anyway - after all, the same letter written in modern English read by a Yorkshireman, a Cockney, a Texan and a Pakistani would likely come out in four very different-sounding versions.



Richard G



--- In , C HOLMES wrote:

>

> Hello Pamela, I read this article re Richard's accent some time ago, it's not new and in my opinion not worth the paper it's written on.

> Richard was brought up first of all at Fotheringhay for about 8 yearsý which is not West Midlands, he would have spent some time in London and possibly Ludlow as life was very peripatetic for people of Richard's rank.

> At the age of ten he went to Middleham for approximately four year so it is likely he would have picked up if not an accent, some of the way of speaking in North Yorks to be understood.

> After that various places he visited for short periods like Wales would have little effect on his accent.

> At 19 years he went back north and was there for approximately 12 years and would have picked up some of the accent, I know he used the language of the north as he used the word Kye ( not sure of the spelling), plural for cows in his letters ( can't remember where is read this but it is accurate). The person who thinks Richard had a west midlands accent has used very little evidence for his idea, I wonder if he lives in Leicester and is trying to make another argument for Richard staying in Leicester.

> The accent for North Yorkshire is very strong and is so today, I'm a Yorkshire lass and I can't understand some of the words used.

> Further argument for a slightly northern accent for Richard would be that he was brought up by two northerners, His mother born at Raby which is now in County Durham and his father born at Conisborough in South Yorks. Both his parents spent their young life together at Raby so both would have been exposed to the local accents.

> I'm no expert on these matters I have to admitý but I believe Richard would have had a slightly northern lilt.

> Loyaulte me Lie.

> Christine

>

>

> ________________________________

> From: Pamela Bain

> To: " "

> Sent: Thursday, 7 February 2013, 22:06

> Subject: Re: Richards accent

>

> Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'

>

> On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" wrote:

>

> > Re authentic accent for Richard:ý Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent?ý I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!!ý I had a thoughtýýý..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded?ý it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!!ý Im sure someone with computer graphicsý can come up with this for us.ý Carol D.

> >

> > ------------------------------------

> >

> > Yahoo! Groups Links

> >

> >

> >

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

> Yahoo! Groups Links

>

>

>

>

>

I must admit to be a bit skeptical that we can really know how someone sounded simply by reading his writing or depending on place of birth/upbringing etc.

As an  example, I often use Australian 'slang' in writing, ending a sentence with the word 'but' instead of using where it would normally be placed in 'proper' english within the sentence structure - phrases like 'no worries' and 'She will be right',  'mate' etc. From these you could assume I sound Australian.

However for more 'serious writing', I can write correct english with no obvious difference between my words and, say, Prince William. But that does not mean I sound like him

Or you may know that I was born in Liverpool, of (paternal) Irish ancestry, so do I sound Irish or 'scouse' maybe? I might actually speak very much like the people of Leicester as I was raised for the first eight years of my life near Ashwell in Rutland , not far from Leicester ( got lost in the supermarket there and ended up having a cup of tea and  jam sandwiches at the police station, wonder how near to Greyfriars I was?)

So while I found this very interesting I don't think we can really say for sure how Richard sounded from what he wrote, the nobility have always sounded quite different from the ordinary people, as their english developed primarily from french, where in Yorkshire it developed in large part from danish.

 I actually have a Bristolian accent where english developed primarily from german (and in speech often has echoes of german such as the use of the word 'bist' as in where bist ? - whach can mean where have you been or where or you going - depending on context).






________________________________
From: C HOLMES <christineholmes651@...>
To: "" <>
Sent: Friday, 8 February 2013 6:27 PM
Subject: Re: Richards accent


 
Hello Pamela, I read this article re Richard's accent some time ago, it's not new and in my opinion not worth the paper it's written on.
Richard was brought up first of all at Fotheringhay for about 8 years which is not West Midlands, he would have spent some time in London and possibly Ludlow as life was very peripatetic for people of Richard's rank.
At the age of ten he went to Middleham for approximately four year so it is likely he would have picked up if not an accent, some of the way of speaking in North Yorks to be understood.
After that various places he visited for short periods like Wales would have little effect on his accent.
At 19 years he went back north and was there for approximately 12 years and would have picked up some of the accent, I know he used the language of the north as he used the word Kye ( not sure of the spelling), plural for cows in his letters ( can't remember where is read this but it is accurate). The person who thinks Richard had a west midlands accent has used very little evidence for his idea, I wonder if he lives in Leicester and is trying to make another argument for Richard staying in Leicester.
The accent for North Yorkshire is very strong and is so today, I'm a Yorkshire lass and I can't understand some of the words used.
Further argument for a slightly northern accent for Richard would be that he was brought up by two northerners, His mother born at Raby which is now in County Durham and his father born at Conisborough in South Yorks. Both his parents spent their young life together at Raby so both would have been exposed to the local accents.
I'm no expert on these matters I have to admit  but I believe Richard would have had a slightly northern lilt.
Loyaulte me Lie.
Christine


________________________________
From: Pamela Bain pbain@...>
To: ">" >
Sent: Thursday, 7 February 2013, 22:06
Subject: Re: Richards accent

Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'

On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" cdarlingart1@...> wrote:

> Re authentic accent for Richard:  Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent?  I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!!  I had a thought&..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded?  it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!!  Im sure someone with computer graphics  can come up with this for us.  Carol D.
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

Thanks again for the information. I would imagine most of us who, during our lives, have lived other places. We speak a polyglot, using words and intonations from each place we lived and learned. Also, my darling husband, who does not have an ear for language, cannot distinguish the different accents, and has to ask me, what was he/she saying. We spent a long period of vacation in England (South) and France. In both places I heard many words and intonations, which fascinated me.

On Feb 8, 2013, at 4:27 AM, "C HOLMES" <christineholmes651@...<mailto:christineholmes651@...>> wrote:



Hello Pamela, I read this article re Richard's accent some time ago, it's not new and in my opinion not worth the paper it's written on.
Richard was brought up first of all at Fotheringhay for about 8 years which is not West Midlands, he would have spent some time in London and possibly Ludlow as life was very peripatetic for people of Richard's rank.
At the age of ten he went to Middleham for approximately four year so it is likely he would have picked up if not an accent, some of the way of speaking in North Yorks to be understood.
After that various places he visited for short periods like Wales would have little effect on his accent.
At 19 years he went back north and was there for approximately 12 years and would have picked up some of the accent, I know he used the language of the north as he used the word Kye ( not sure of the spelling), plural for cows in his letters ( can't remember where is read this but it is accurate). The person who thinks Richard had a west midlands accent has used very little evidence for his idea, I wonder if he lives in Leicester and is trying to make another argument for Richard staying in Leicester.
The accent for North Yorkshire is very strong and is so today, I'm a Yorkshire lass and I can't understand some of the words used.
Further argument for a slightly northern accent for Richard would be that he was brought up by two northerners, His mother born at Raby which is now in County Durham and his father born at Conisborough in South Yorks. Both his parents spent their young life together at Raby so both would have been exposed to the local accents.
I'm no expert on these matters I have to admit but I believe Richard would have had a slightly northern lilt.
Loyaulte me Lie.
Christine


________________________________
From: Pamela Bain pbain@...<mailto:pbain%40bmbi.com>>
To: "<mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>>" <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>>
Sent: Thursday, 7 February 2013, 22:06
Subject: Re: Richards accent

Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'

On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" cdarlingart1@...<mailto:cdarlingart1%40mac.com>> wrote:

> Re authentic accent for Richard: Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent? I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!! I had a thoughtý..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded? it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!! Im sure someone with computer graphics can come up with this for us. Carol D.
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

You betcha......there is a really good website, name forgotten, where a voice coach is working with a young woman teaching the accents of spoken English in England, North, South, Midlands, Cockney, proper plummy upper class, Ireland, Scotland, some tiny and some huge differences. Even in Texas, those of in large cities speak more or less the same, but as you travel outward toward North, South, East and West, whoa Nellie, things change. And in New Orleans, the accents vary from Uptown to what is called Yat, which is closer to a New York/Brooklyn accent. I love words, accents, how they change and how, with some study you can make a fair guess s to where someone was born, raised, educated, or whatever.

On Feb 8, 2013, at 5:01 AM, "Richard" <RSG_Corris@...<mailto:RSG_Corris@...>> wrote:



A child picks up an accent from those around him or her. While the common people in Fotheringhay would have had medieval East Midlands accents, and the common people in Middleham would have had medieval Yorkshire accents, the main influence on the way Richard spoke would have been his family (both Nevilles and Plantagenets) and his attendants - including those teaching him Latin and martial skills - who could have come from other parts of the country. While he certainly would have needed to understand the Yorkshire dialect, that does not mean that he would have spoken it when conversing with other members of the nobility.

Listening to the Uni of Leicester recording I thought the speaker was giving the words in Richard's letter more of a Scottish lilt than a West Midlands one. I question just how far you can establish a speaker's accent from his written words anyway - after all, the same letter written in modern English read by a Yorkshireman, a Cockney, a Texan and a Pakistani would likely come out in four very different-sounding versions.

Richard G

--- In <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, C HOLMES wrote:
>
> Hello Pamela, I read this article re Richard's accent some time ago, it's not new and in my opinion not worth the paper it's written on.
> Richard was brought up first of all at Fotheringhay for about 8 yearsý which is not West Midlands, he would have spent some time in London and possibly Ludlow as life was very peripatetic for people of Richard's rank.
> At the age of ten he went to Middleham for approximately four year so it is likely he would have picked up if not an accent, some of the way of speaking in North Yorks to be understood.
> After that various places he visited for short periods like Wales would have little effect on his accent.
> At 19 years he went back north and was there for approximately 12 years and would have picked up some of the accent, I know he used the language of the north as he used the word Kye ( not sure of the spelling), plural for cows in his letters ( can't remember where is read this but it is accurate). The person who thinks Richard had a west midlands accent has used very little evidence for his idea, I wonder if he lives in Leicester and is trying to make another argument for Richard staying in Leicester.
> The accent for North Yorkshire is very strong and is so today, I'm a Yorkshire lass and I can't understand some of the words used.
> Further argument for a slightly northern accent for Richard would be that he was brought up by two northerners, His mother born at Raby which is now in County Durham and his father born at Conisborough in South Yorks. Both his parents spent their young life together at Raby so both would have been exposed to the local accents.
> I'm no expert on these matters I have to admitý but I believe Richard would have had a slightly northern lilt.
> Loyaulte me Lie.
> Christine
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Pamela Bain
> To: " "
> Sent: Thursday, 7 February 2013, 22:06
> Subject: Re: Richards accent
>
> Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'
>
> On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" wrote:
>
> > Re authentic accent for Richard:ý Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent?ý I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!!ý I had a thoughtýýý..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded?ý it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!!ý Im sure someone with computer graphicsý can come up with this for us.ý Carol D.
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>

I got the impression that the ULeic English prof was basing his pronunciation on Richard's spelling. It's a fair basis for interpretation, as English orthography really only got standardized when printing was established as a mature industry. (Kind of like Received Pronunciation, spelling was squeezed into a vise so that a text printed in, say, Philadelphia would not vary appreciably from one from Liverpool.)

English has always lent itself to a wide variety of accents, which means both that English speakers have a lot of practice at extracting words from different pronunciations and that non-native speakers are not disadvantaged by impenetrable accents (mostly).

Having said that, the ULeic prof (how silly, I just read his name an hour ago and can't remember it now) didn't really seem to be all that confident of his pronunciation--he tripped over a couple of phrases and had to start over. This gave his reading a stilted, unnatural sound, so it's not what one would have expected of a native speaker of Richard's time.

--- In , "Richard" wrote:
>
> A child picks up an accent from those around him or her. While the common people in Fotheringhay would have had medieval East Midlands accents, and the common people in Middleham would have had medieval Yorkshire accents, the main influence on the way Richard spoke would have been his family (both Nevilles and Plantagenets) and his attendants - including those teaching him Latin and martial skills - who could have come from other parts of the country. While he certainly would have needed to understand the Yorkshire dialect, that does not mean that he would have spoken it when conversing with other members of the nobility.
>
> Listening to the Uni of Leicester recording I thought the speaker was giving the words in Richard's letter more of a Scottish lilt than a West Midlands one. I question just how far you can establish a speaker's accent from his written words anyway - after all, the same letter written in modern English read by a Yorkshireman, a Cockney, a Texan and a Pakistani would likely come out in four very different-sounding versions.
>
> Richard G
>
> --- In , C HOLMES wrote:
> >
> > Hello Pamela, I read this article re Richard's accent some time ago, it's not new and in my opinion not worth the paper it's written on.
> > Richard was brought up first of all at Fotheringhay for about 8 years which is not West Midlands, he would have spent some time in London and possibly Ludlow as life was very peripatetic for people of Richard's rank.
> > At the age of ten he went to Middleham for approximately four year so it is likely he would have picked up if not an accent, some of the way of speaking in North Yorks to be understood.
> > After that various places he visited for short periods like Wales would have little effect on his accent.
> > At 19 years he went back north and was there for approximately 12 years and would have picked up some of the accent, I know he used the language of the north as he used the word Kye ( not sure of the spelling), plural for cows in his letters ( can't remember where is read this but it is accurate). The person who thinks Richard had a west midlands accent has used very little evidence for his idea, I wonder if he lives in Leicester and is trying to make another argument for Richard staying in Leicester.
> > The accent for North Yorkshire is very strong and is so today, I'm a Yorkshire lass and I can't understand some of the words used.
> > Further argument for a slightly northern accent for Richard would be that he was brought up by two northerners, His mother born at Raby which is now in County Durham and his father born at Conisborough in South Yorks. Both his parents spent their young life together at Raby so both would have been exposed to the local accents.
> > I'm no expert on these matters I have to admit  but I believe Richard would have had a slightly northern lilt.
> > Loyaulte me Lie.
> > Christine
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: Pamela Bain
> > To: " "
> > Sent: Thursday, 7 February 2013, 22:06
> > Subject: Re: Richards accent
> >
> > Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'
> >
> > On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" wrote:
> >
> > > Re authentic accent for Richard:  Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent?  I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!!  I had a thought…..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded?  it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!!  Im sure someone with computer graphics  can come up with this for us.  Carol D.
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

As a extremely poor speller ( something between hieroglyphics and cuneiform) I am always delighted to find that Shakespeare spelt he name at least 5 different ways on various manuscripts. How I got a E.Lang O level I have no idea!

George

From: [mailto:] On Behalf Of mcjohn_wt_net
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2013 9:37 AM
To:
Subject: Re: Richards accent





I got the impression that the ULeic English prof was basing his pronunciation on Richard's spelling. It's a fair basis for interpretation, as English orthography really only got standardized when printing was established as a mature industry. (Kind of like Received Pronunciation, spelling was squeezed into a vise so that a text printed in, say, Philadelphia would not vary appreciably from one from Liverpool.)

English has always lent itself to a wide variety of accents, which means both that English speakers have a lot of practice at extracting words from different pronunciations and that non-native speakers are not disadvantaged by impenetrable accents (mostly).

Having said that, the ULeic prof (how silly, I just read his name an hour ago and can't remember it now) didn't really seem to be all that confident of his pronunciation--he tripped over a couple of phrases and had to start over. This gave his reading a stilted, unnatural sound, so it's not what one would have expected of a native speaker of Richard's time.

--- In <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com> , "Richard" wrote:
>
> A child picks up an accent from those around him or her. While the common people in Fotheringhay would have had medieval East Midlands accents, and the common people in Middleham would have had medieval Yorkshire accents, the main influence on the way Richard spoke would have been his family (both Nevilles and Plantagenets) and his attendants - including those teaching him Latin and martial skills - who could have come from other parts of the country. While he certainly would have needed to understand the Yorkshire dialect, that does not mean that he would have spoken it when conversing with other members of the nobility.
>
> Listening to the Uni of Leicester recording I thought the speaker was giving the words in Richard's letter more of a Scottish lilt than a West Midlands one. I question just how far you can establish a speaker's accent from his written words anyway - after all, the same letter written in modern English read by a Yorkshireman, a Cockney, a Texan and a Pakistani would likely come out in four very different-sounding versions.
>
> Richard G
>
> --- In <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com> , C HOLMES wrote:
> >
> > Hello Pamela, I read this article re Richard's accent some time ago, it's not new and in my opinion not worth the paper it's written on.
> > Richard was brought up first of all at Fotheringhay for about 8 years which is not West Midlands, he would have spent some time in London and possibly Ludlow as life was very peripatetic for people of Richard's rank.
> > At the age of ten he went to Middleham for approximately four year so it is likely he would have picked up if not an accent, some of the way of speaking in North Yorks to be understood.
> > After that various places he visited for short periods like Wales would have little effect on his accent.
> > At 19 years he went back north and was there for approximately 12 years and would have picked up some of the accent, I know he used the language of the north as he used the word Kye ( not sure of the spelling), plural for cows in his letters ( can't remember where is read this but it is accurate). The person who thinks Richard had a west midlands accent has used very little evidence for his idea, I wonder if he lives in Leicester and is trying to make another argument for Richard staying in Leicester.
> > The accent for North Yorkshire is very strong and is so today, I'm a Yorkshire lass and I can't understand some of the words used.
> > Further argument for a slightly northern accent for Richard would be that he was brought up by two northerners, His mother born at Raby which is now in County Durham and his father born at Conisborough in South Yorks. Both his parents spent their young life together at Raby so both would have been exposed to the local accents.
> > I'm no expert on these matters I have to admit but I believe Richard would have had a slightly northern lilt.
> > Loyaulte me Lie.
> > Christine
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: Pamela Bain
> > To: " "
> > Sent: Thursday, 7 February 2013, 22:06
> > Subject: Re: Richards accent
> >
> > Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'
> >
> > On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" wrote:
> >
> > > Re authentic accent for Richard: Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent? I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!! I had a thought⬦..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded? it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!! Im sure someone with computer graphics can come up with this for us. Carol D.
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

C HOLMES wrote:
>
> [Snip] I know he used the language of the north as he used the word Kye ( not sure of the spelling), plural for cows in his letters ( can't remember where is read this but it is accurate). [Snip]

Carol responds:

The article (if we're talking about the same one) is based only on Richard's postscripts, which he wrote in his own hand. Are you sure that it was Richard himself who used "kye" and not his secretary, John Kendall (or a scribe--I'm not sure how many of the letters Kendall would have written himself. Some of them are quite formulaic but others (the one about Thomas Lynom and Mistress Shore, for example) reflect Richard's personality and were certainly recorded verbatim. Whether they reflect his accent and spelling is another matter.

Does anyone know where Kendall was from? My recollection is that he was a Northerner.

Not arguing with you, Christine, but I think it quite likely that Richard (and Warwick, in whose house he spent so much time) spoke the same dialect as Edward IV but that Richard, gifted as he was, could readily switch to a Yorkshire dialect to speak with the people of the North, which may be one of the reasons they loved him so much (and gave him all those presents of fish).

Carol

I think it's not a sensible exercise. The samples of Richard's own writing are just far too small. I can't see anything in them to suggest a particular regional accent at all, though they unsurprisingly indicate that he didn't use actual dialect words and constructions when writing, none of which is surprising. It would be nice if the guy had given us his reasoning.
Marie

--- In , "Richard" wrote:
>
> A child picks up an accent from those around him or her. While the common people in Fotheringhay would have had medieval East Midlands accents, and the common people in Middleham would have had medieval Yorkshire accents, the main influence on the way Richard spoke would have been his family (both Nevilles and Plantagenets) and his attendants - including those teaching him Latin and martial skills - who could have come from other parts of the country. While he certainly would have needed to understand the Yorkshire dialect, that does not mean that he would have spoken it when conversing with other members of the nobility.
>
> Listening to the Uni of Leicester recording I thought the speaker was giving the words in Richard's letter more of a Scottish lilt than a West Midlands one. I question just how far you can establish a speaker's accent from his written words anyway - after all, the same letter written in modern English read by a Yorkshireman, a Cockney, a Texan and a Pakistani would likely come out in four very different-sounding versions.
>
> Richard G
>
> --- In , C HOLMES wrote:
> >
> > Hello Pamela, I read this article re Richard's accent some time ago, it's not new and in my opinion not worth the paper it's written on.
> > Richard was brought up first of all at Fotheringhay for about 8 years which is not West Midlands, he would have spent some time in London and possibly Ludlow as life was very peripatetic for people of Richard's rank.
> > At the age of ten he went to Middleham for approximately four year so it is likely he would have picked up if not an accent, some of the way of speaking in North Yorks to be understood.
> > After that various places he visited for short periods like Wales would have little effect on his accent.
> > At 19 years he went back north and was there for approximately 12 years and would have picked up some of the accent, I know he used the language of the north as he used the word Kye ( not sure of the spelling), plural for cows in his letters ( can't remember where is read this but it is accurate). The person who thinks Richard had a west midlands accent has used very little evidence for his idea, I wonder if he lives in Leicester and is trying to make another argument for Richard staying in Leicester.
> > The accent for North Yorkshire is very strong and is so today, I'm a Yorkshire lass and I can't understand some of the words used.
> > Further argument for a slightly northern accent for Richard would be that he was brought up by two northerners, His mother born at Raby which is now in County Durham and his father born at Conisborough in South Yorks. Both his parents spent their young life together at Raby so both would have been exposed to the local accents.
> > I'm no expert on these matters I have to admit  but I believe Richard would have had a slightly northern lilt.
> > Loyaulte me Lie.
> > Christine
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: Pamela Bain
> > To: " "
> > Sent: Thursday, 7 February 2013, 22:06
> > Subject: Re: Richards accent
> >
> > Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'
> >
> > On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" wrote:
> >
> > > Re authentic accent for Richard:  Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent?  I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!!  I had a thought…..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded?  it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!!  Im sure someone with computer graphics  can come up with this for us.  Carol D.
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

It is, but I'm not sure what it is in Richard's spelling that he's latching on to. I'd be interested to know.
Marie

--- In , Jacqueline Harvey wrote:
>
>
> I understood, though I could be wrong, that the way the words were spelled in the letters are an indication of the accent used.
> Of course at that time, there wasn't a standard English spelling.
> Jacq
>
> To:
> From: RSG_Corris@...
> Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2013 11:01:53 +0000
> Subject: Re: Richards accent
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> A child picks up an accent from those around him or her. While the common people in Fotheringhay would have had medieval East Midlands accents, and the common people in Middleham would have had medieval Yorkshire accents, the main influence on the way Richard spoke would have been his family (both Nevilles and Plantagenets) and his attendants - including those teaching him Latin and martial skills - who could have come from other parts of the country. While he certainly would have needed to understand the Yorkshire dialect, that does not mean that he would have spoken it when conversing with other members of the nobility.
>
>
>
> Listening to the Uni of Leicester recording I thought the speaker was giving the words in Richard's letter more of a Scottish lilt than a West Midlands one. I question just how far you can establish a speaker's accent from his written words anyway - after all, the same letter written in modern English read by a Yorkshireman, a Cockney, a Texan and a Pakistani would likely come out in four very different-sounding versions.
>
>
>
> Richard G
>
>
>
> --- In , C HOLMES wrote:
>
> >
>
> > Hello Pamela, I read this article re Richard's accent some time ago, it's not new and in my opinion not worth the paper it's written on.
>
> > Richard was brought up first of all at Fotheringhay for about 8 years which is not West Midlands, he would have spent some time in London and possibly Ludlow as life was very peripatetic for people of Richard's rank.
>
> > At the age of ten he went to Middleham for approximately four year so it is likely he would have picked up if not an accent, some of the way of speaking in North Yorks to be understood.
>
> > After that various places he visited for short periods like Wales would have little effect on his accent.
>
> > At 19 years he went back north and was there for approximately 12 years and would have picked up some of the accent, I know he used the language of the north as he used the word Kye ( not sure of the spelling), plural for cows in his letters ( can't remember where is read this but it is accurate). The person who thinks Richard had a west midlands accent has used very little evidence for his idea, I wonder if he lives in Leicester and is trying to make another argument for Richard staying in Leicester.
>
> > The accent for North Yorkshire is very strong and is so today, I'm a Yorkshire lass and I can't understand some of the words used.
>
> > Further argument for a slightly northern accent for Richard would be that he was brought up by two northerners, His mother born at Raby which is now in County Durham and his father born at Conisborough in South Yorks. Both his parents spent their young life together at Raby so both would have been exposed to the local accents.
>
> > I'm no expert on these matters I have to admit but I believe Richard would have had a slightly northern lilt.
>
> > Loyaulte me Lie.
>
> > Christine
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > ________________________________
>
> > From: Pamela Bain
>
> > To: " "
>
> > Sent: Thursday, 7 February 2013, 22:06
>
> > Subject: Re: Richards accent
>
> >
>
> > Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'
>
> >
>
> > On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" wrote:
>
> >
>
> > > Re authentic accent for Richard: Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent? I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!! I had a thought…..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded? it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!! Im sure someone with computer graphics can come up with this for us. Carol D.
>
> > >
>
> > > ------------------------------------
>
> > >
>
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> > >
>
> > >
>
> > >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > ------------------------------------
>
> >
>
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Maybe he was from Kendal (in the Lake District for non Brits)


From: justcarol67 <justcarol67@...>
To:
Sent: Friday, 8 February 2013, 16:18
Subject: Re: Richards accent

 
C HOLMES wrote:
>
> [Snip] I know he used the language of the north as he used the word Kye ( not sure of the spelling), plural for cows in his letters ( can't remember where is read this but it is accurate). [Snip]

Carol responds:

The article (if we're talking about the same one) is based only on Richard's postscripts, which he wrote in his own hand. Are you sure that it was Richard himself who used "kye" and not his secretary, John Kendall (or a scribe--I'm not sure how many of the letters Kendall would have written himself. Some of them are quite formulaic but others (the one about Thomas Lynom and Mistress Shore, for example) reflect Richard's personality and were certainly recorded verbatim. Whether they reflect his accent and spelling is another matter.

Does anyone know where Kendall was from? My recollection is that he was a Northerner.

Not arguing with you, Christine, but I think it quite likely that Richard (and Warwick, in whose house he spent so much time) spoke the same dialect as Edward IV but that Richard, gifted as he was, could readily switch to a Yorkshire dialect to speak with the people of the North, which may be one of the reasons they loved him so much (and gave him all those presents of fish).

Carol

That's actually not a bad assumption. Did Wordsworth use 'kye'. I've certainly heard it somewhere else before in a different context?


________________________________
From: liz williams <ferrymansdaughter@...>
To: "" <>
Sent: Friday, 8 February 2013, 16:40
Subject: Re: Re: Richards accent


 

Maybe he was from Kendal (in the Lake District for non Brits)

From: justcarol67 mailto:justcarol67%40yahoo.com>
To: mailto:%40yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, 8 February 2013, 16:18
Subject: Re: Richards accent

 
C HOLMES wrote:
>
> [Snip] I know he used the language of the north as he used the word Kye ( not sure of the spelling), plural for cows in his letters ( can't remember where is read this but it is accurate). [Snip]

Carol responds:

The article (if we're talking about the same one) is based only on Richard's postscripts, which he wrote in his own hand. Are you sure that it was Richard himself who used "kye" and not his secretary, John Kendall (or a scribe--I'm not sure how many of the letters Kendall would have written himself. Some of them are quite formulaic but others (the one about Thomas Lynom and Mistress Shore, for example) reflect Richard's personality and were certainly recorded verbatim. Whether they reflect his accent and spelling is another matter.

Does anyone know where Kendall was from? My recollection is that he was a Northerner.

Not arguing with you, Christine, but I think it quite likely that Richard (and Warwick, in whose house he spent so much time) spoke the same dialect as Edward IV but that Richard, gifted as he was, could readily switch to a Yorkshire dialect to speak with the people of the North, which may be one of the reasons they loved him so much (and gave him all those presents of fish).

Carol

I've not seen this, but it was common for n's and m's to be missed out, with a bar over the spot as an omission mark - saved time and precious parchment - so kyne may be the proper reading.
Marie


--- In , "justcarol67" wrote:
>
> C HOLMES wrote:
> >
> > [Snip] I know he used the language of the north as he used the word Kye ( not sure of the spelling), plural for cows in his letters ( can't remember where is read this but it is accurate). [Snip]
>
> Carol responds:
>
> The article (if we're talking about the same one) is based only on Richard's postscripts, which he wrote in his own hand. Are you sure that it was Richard himself who used "kye" and not his secretary, John Kendall (or a scribe--I'm not sure how many of the letters Kendall would have written himself. Some of them are quite formulaic but others (the one about Thomas Lynom and Mistress Shore, for example) reflect Richard's personality and were certainly recorded verbatim. Whether they reflect his accent and spelling is another matter.
>
> Does anyone know where Kendall was from? My recollection is that he was a Northerner.
>
> Not arguing with you, Christine, but I think it quite likely that Richard (and Warwick, in whose house he spent so much time) spoke the same dialect as Edward IV but that Richard, gifted as he was, could readily switch to a Yorkshire dialect to speak with the people of the North, which may be one of the reasons they loved him so much (and gave him all those presents of fish).
>
> Carol
>

Aidan Donnelly wrote:
[snip]
> So while I found this very interesting I don't think we can really say for sure how Richard sounded from what he wrote, the nobility have always sounded quite different from the ordinary people, as their english developed primarily from french, where in Yorkshire it developed in large part from danish.
>
>  I actually have a Bristolian accent where english developed primarily from german (and in speech often has echoes of german such as the use of the word 'bist' as in where bist ? - whach can mean where have you been or where or you going - depending on context).

Carol responds:

English is a Germanic language that developed from dialects spoken by the Angles, Saxons, Jutes, Frisians, and a few others. After the Norman invasion, it was, of course, influenced by Norman French, an influence that trickled down into the language of the common people when the nobility started speaking English as a birth language a few generations after Richard. English in the north was influenced by the Danish of the Vikings but did not develop from it. (The Vikings were one reason why the complex inflections [word endings] of Old English, aka Anglo-Saxon, eroded into the -e endings common in Middle English.) Chaucer's works helped to make the Midland dialect standard for written English though it would not, of course, have affected pronunciation.

This is a very quick summary, omitting vowel shifts and other details. My point is that English at no point developed from French or German though, like German, it developed from a Germanic dialect. (German derives from Old High German and English from Old Low German, with "high" and "low" reflecting geographic regions, not social class.)

Carol

The spelling of Shakespeare's name wasn't standardized for a long time after his death, either. I have an eight volume miniature Shakespeare which dates from about 1851, and it has "Shakspeare" on the cover, but uses "Shakespere" on the title page. Beautiful little books - they've been in my family since new.

--- In , "George Butterfield" wrote:
>
> As a extremely poor speller ( something between hieroglyphics and cuneiform) I am always delighted to find that Shakespeare spelt he name at least 5 different ways on various manuscripts. How I got a E.Lang O level I have no idea!

Yeah, I thought about that too. On the other hand, I can very much understand how ULeic is going to trot out everybody but the catfood officer at the moment... this is enough to make their reputation for the next three generations and they're smart to make the most of their opportunity. What's the English prof supposed to talk about, how Shakespeare's wrong? He'd get strung up.

--- In , mariewalsh2003 wrote:
>
> I think it's not a sensible exercise. The samples of Richard's own writing are just far too small. I can't see anything in them to suggest a particular regional accent at all, though they unsurprisingly indicate that he didn't use actual dialect words and constructions when writing, none of which is surprising. It would be nice if the guy had given us his reasoning.
> Marie
>
> --- In , "Richard" wrote:
> >
> > A child picks up an accent from those around him or her. While the common people in Fotheringhay would have had medieval East Midlands accents, and the common people in Middleham would have had medieval Yorkshire accents, the main influence on the way Richard spoke would have been his family (both Nevilles and Plantagenets) and his attendants - including those teaching him Latin and martial skills - who could have come from other parts of the country. While he certainly would have needed to understand the Yorkshire dialect, that does not mean that he would have spoken it when conversing with other members of the nobility.
> >
> > Listening to the Uni of Leicester recording I thought the speaker was giving the words in Richard's letter more of a Scottish lilt than a West Midlands one. I question just how far you can establish a speaker's accent from his written words anyway - after all, the same letter written in modern English read by a Yorkshireman, a Cockney, a Texan and a Pakistani would likely come out in four very different-sounding versions.
> >
> > Richard G
> >
> > --- In , C HOLMES wrote:
> > >
> > > Hello Pamela, I read this article re Richard's accent some time ago, it's not new and in my opinion not worth the paper it's written on.
> > > Richard was brought up first of all at Fotheringhay for about 8 years which is not West Midlands, he would have spent some time in London and possibly Ludlow as life was very peripatetic for people of Richard's rank.
> > > At the age of ten he went to Middleham for approximately four year so it is likely he would have picked up if not an accent, some of the way of speaking in North Yorks to be understood.
> > > After that various places he visited for short periods like Wales would have little effect on his accent.
> > > At 19 years he went back north and was there for approximately 12 years and would have picked up some of the accent, I know he used the language of the north as he used the word Kye ( not sure of the spelling), plural for cows in his letters ( can't remember where is read this but it is accurate). The person who thinks Richard had a west midlands accent has used very little evidence for his idea, I wonder if he lives in Leicester and is trying to make another argument for Richard staying in Leicester.
> > > The accent for North Yorkshire is very strong and is so today, I'm a Yorkshire lass and I can't understand some of the words used.
> > > Further argument for a slightly northern accent for Richard would be that he was brought up by two northerners, His mother born at Raby which is now in County Durham and his father born at Conisborough in South Yorks. Both his parents spent their young life together at Raby so both would have been exposed to the local accents.
> > > I'm no expert on these matters I have to admit  but I believe Richard would have had a slightly northern lilt.
> > > Loyaulte me Lie.
> > > Christine
> > >
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: Pamela Bain
> > > To: " "
> > > Sent: Thursday, 7 February 2013, 22:06
> > > Subject: Re: Richards accent
> > >
> > > Aw Honey, I just bet we could thank of something'
> > >
> > > On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Carol Darling" wrote:
> > >
> > > > Re authentic accent for Richard:  Who would have thought 10 years ago not only would we be seeing Richards body, his facial reconstruction but be also able to hear his spoken regional accent?  I feel like I have eaten too much candy!!!  I had a thought…..I wonder how Richard would have sounded speaking with one of these distinct Texas Hill Country accents, with which I am surrounded?  it would certainly give us all a much needed good laugh!!!  Im sure someone with computer graphics  can come up with this for us.  Carol D.
> > > >
> > > > ------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>

Hilary Jones wrote:
>
> That's actually not a bad assumption. Did Wordsworth use 'kye'. I've certainly heard it somewhere else before in a different context?

Carol responds:

There are searchable Wordsworth concordances online. I just checked one and the closest word to "kye" is an adjective only Wordsworth would use (okay, don't jump on me if I'm wrong), "skyey," presumably meaning "skylike" or resembling the sky. I didn't look up the context since it's not relevant to the discussion.

Carol