Perkin descendents
Perkin descendents
2013-02-26 19:17:53
Re: Perking descendants&.I will hold my breath but remain in touch with Stephen Lark until he finishes his current project. We need to take the possibility of Perkin Warbeck modern descendants as far as we can because of the remote possibility of the connection to the younger Prince. I read the two arguments for and against Perkin Warbeck being the younger Prince Richard, and an amazing thing happened!!! Each very persuasive author presenting each argument either for and against the Prince, had me totally convinced. I realized that the power of a good argument and even the correct placement of proven facts, can color an unknown situation one way or another. Epiphany!!! So&I feel it remains to be proven if Perkin was Prince Richard, and hope we can resolve it. Those modern relatives may live, lets find them. We have learned with Richards discovery&..anything can be done!!! Carol D.
Re: Perkin descendents
2013-02-26 20:44:07
--- In , Carol Darling <cdarlingart1@...> wrote:
>
> Re: Perking descendants….I will hold my breath but remain in touch with Stephen Lark until he finishes his current project. We need to take the possibility of Perkin Warbeck modern descendants as far as we can because of the remote possibility of the connection to the younger Prince. I read the two arguments for and against Perkin Warbeck being the younger Prince Richard, and an amazing thing happened!!! Each very persuasive author presenting each argument either for and against the Prince, had me totally convinced. I realized that the power of a good argument and even the correct placement of proven facts, can color an unknown situation one way or another. Epiphany!!! So…I feel it remains to be proven if Perkin was Prince Richard, and hope we can resolve it. Those modern relatives may live, lets find them. We have learned with Richards discovery…..anything can be done!!! Carol D.
>
Carol responds:
But since Perkin was male, we would need a straight line of male descent to provide a suitable Y chromosome. MtDNA would be useless in this instance, and nuclear DNA other than the Y chromosome is just too complex and too jumbled in the process of heredity to be of any use--at least in the current state of DNA research.
It does appear, though, that Richard of Eastwell will be exhumed and his Y chromosome compared with Richard's. Although the researchers are trying to determine whether he was Richard's illegitimate son (not John of Gloucester but another, unacknowledged son),
Edward's sons would have had that same Y chromosome (assuming Edward's own legitimacy)--and, IMO, it's much more likely that Richard of Eastwell is the former Duke of York than that Richard would acknowledge two bastard children and leave a third unacknowledged. Of course, if Richard of Eastwell was the real Richard ex-Duke of York, that would mean Perkin Warbeck was not. (Theoretically, R of E could also have been the former Edward V.)
Anyway, all we would find is a genetic link, not proof of identity, but it's fascinating, nonetheless.
Carol
>
> Re: Perking descendants….I will hold my breath but remain in touch with Stephen Lark until he finishes his current project. We need to take the possibility of Perkin Warbeck modern descendants as far as we can because of the remote possibility of the connection to the younger Prince. I read the two arguments for and against Perkin Warbeck being the younger Prince Richard, and an amazing thing happened!!! Each very persuasive author presenting each argument either for and against the Prince, had me totally convinced. I realized that the power of a good argument and even the correct placement of proven facts, can color an unknown situation one way or another. Epiphany!!! So…I feel it remains to be proven if Perkin was Prince Richard, and hope we can resolve it. Those modern relatives may live, lets find them. We have learned with Richards discovery…..anything can be done!!! Carol D.
>
Carol responds:
But since Perkin was male, we would need a straight line of male descent to provide a suitable Y chromosome. MtDNA would be useless in this instance, and nuclear DNA other than the Y chromosome is just too complex and too jumbled in the process of heredity to be of any use--at least in the current state of DNA research.
It does appear, though, that Richard of Eastwell will be exhumed and his Y chromosome compared with Richard's. Although the researchers are trying to determine whether he was Richard's illegitimate son (not John of Gloucester but another, unacknowledged son),
Edward's sons would have had that same Y chromosome (assuming Edward's own legitimacy)--and, IMO, it's much more likely that Richard of Eastwell is the former Duke of York than that Richard would acknowledge two bastard children and leave a third unacknowledged. Of course, if Richard of Eastwell was the real Richard ex-Duke of York, that would mean Perkin Warbeck was not. (Theoretically, R of E could also have been the former Edward V.)
Anyway, all we would find is a genetic link, not proof of identity, but it's fascinating, nonetheless.
Carol
Re: Perkin descendents
2013-02-27 11:41:37
I'm sure I've read that the tomb they thought was Richard of Eastwell's belonged to one of the local gentry? Tombstones were pretty rare except for the rich then. I hope they don't dig up the wrong bloke!
________________________________
From: justcarol67 <justcarol67@...>
To:
Sent: Tuesday, 26 February 2013, 20:44
Subject: Re: Perkin descendents
--- In , Carol Darling wrote:
>
> Re: Perking descendants&.I will hold my breath but remain in touch with Stephen Lark until he finishes his current project. We need to take the possibility of Perkin Warbeck modern descendants as far as we can because of the remote possibility of the connection to the younger Prince. I read the two arguments for and against Perkin Warbeck being the younger Prince Richard, and an amazing thing happened!!! Each very persuasive author presenting each argument either for and against the Prince, had me totally convinced. I realized that the power of a good argument and even the correct placement of proven facts, can color an unknown situation one way or another. Epiphany!!! So&I feel it remains to be proven if Perkin was Prince Richard, and hope we can resolve it. Those modern relatives may live, lets find them. We have learned with Richards discovery&..anything can be done!!! Carol D.
>
Carol responds:
But since Perkin was male, we would need a straight line of male descent to provide a suitable Y chromosome. MtDNA would be useless in this instance, and nuclear DNA other than the Y chromosome is just too complex and too jumbled in the process of heredity to be of any use--at least in the current state of DNA research.
It does appear, though, that Richard of Eastwell will be exhumed and his Y chromosome compared with Richard's. Although the researchers are trying to determine whether he was Richard's illegitimate son (not John of Gloucester but another, unacknowledged son),
Edward's sons would have had that same Y chromosome (assuming Edward's own legitimacy)--and, IMO, it's much more likely that Richard of Eastwell is the former Duke of York than that Richard would acknowledge two bastard children and leave a third unacknowledged. Of course, if Richard of Eastwell was the real Richard ex-Duke of York, that would mean Perkin Warbeck was not. (Theoretically, R of E could also have been the former Edward V.)
Anyway, all we would find is a genetic link, not proof of identity, but it's fascinating, nonetheless.
Carol
________________________________
From: justcarol67 <justcarol67@...>
To:
Sent: Tuesday, 26 February 2013, 20:44
Subject: Re: Perkin descendents
--- In , Carol Darling wrote:
>
> Re: Perking descendants&.I will hold my breath but remain in touch with Stephen Lark until he finishes his current project. We need to take the possibility of Perkin Warbeck modern descendants as far as we can because of the remote possibility of the connection to the younger Prince. I read the two arguments for and against Perkin Warbeck being the younger Prince Richard, and an amazing thing happened!!! Each very persuasive author presenting each argument either for and against the Prince, had me totally convinced. I realized that the power of a good argument and even the correct placement of proven facts, can color an unknown situation one way or another. Epiphany!!! So&I feel it remains to be proven if Perkin was Prince Richard, and hope we can resolve it. Those modern relatives may live, lets find them. We have learned with Richards discovery&..anything can be done!!! Carol D.
>
Carol responds:
But since Perkin was male, we would need a straight line of male descent to provide a suitable Y chromosome. MtDNA would be useless in this instance, and nuclear DNA other than the Y chromosome is just too complex and too jumbled in the process of heredity to be of any use--at least in the current state of DNA research.
It does appear, though, that Richard of Eastwell will be exhumed and his Y chromosome compared with Richard's. Although the researchers are trying to determine whether he was Richard's illegitimate son (not John of Gloucester but another, unacknowledged son),
Edward's sons would have had that same Y chromosome (assuming Edward's own legitimacy)--and, IMO, it's much more likely that Richard of Eastwell is the former Duke of York than that Richard would acknowledge two bastard children and leave a third unacknowledged. Of course, if Richard of Eastwell was the real Richard ex-Duke of York, that would mean Perkin Warbeck was not. (Theoretically, R of E could also have been the former Edward V.)
Anyway, all we would find is a genetic link, not proof of identity, but it's fascinating, nonetheless.
Carol
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