Time to lay another myth to rest

This one is about the Staffords. The Received Wisdom is that that, after Edward, 3rd Duke of Buckingham, was executed in 1521, the family lost all of their titles.

1) Jorge Castilla ("tudorplace") reveals that Edward VI created Henry Stafford (Duke Edward's eldest son and Thomas' father) Baron Stafford in 1548. Two of his sons inherited the title (both younger than Thomas who predeceased Baron Henry). I have found a paternal grandson and, possibly, a great-grandson.

2) The Daily Mail Year Book 1985 (House of Lords, p.231) reveals that, in that year, the 14th Baron lived. His family name was Fitzherbert and he was born in 1926. To inherit a title, you MUST be descended from the original creation.

3) If I subtract 390 (13x30), an estimated date of birth would be 1536. Baron Henry Stafford was born in 1501. He was married, of course, to Ursula Pole giving his heirs Yorkist (Clarence) blood as well.

4) Whilst the family were Lancastrian in their origins (the second Duke, 1455-83, was Henry VII's second cousin born in the same year to another Margaret Beaufort), they become Yorkist after 1483. One Humphrey Stafford was executed in 1485 for defending Richard at Bosworth; "tudorplace" is so large a database that I found him on Tuesday and have lost him since.

5) The second Duke's name was definitely Henry. Some people have thought him to be a Humphrey but this is a separate individual I have described above.

--- In , "Stephen Lark"
<smlark@t...> wrote:
> This one is about the Staffords. The Received Wisdom is that that,
after Edward, 3rd Duke of Buckingham, was executed in 1521, the
family lost all of their titles.
>
> 1) Jorge Castilla ("tudorplace") reveals that Edward VI created
Henry Stafford (Duke Edward's eldest son and Thomas' father) Baron
Stafford in 1548. Two of his sons inherited the title (both younger
than Thomas who predeceased Baron Henry). I have found a paternal
grandson and, possibly, a great-grandson.
>
> 2) The Daily Mail Year Book 1985 (House of Lords, p.231) reveals
that, in that year, the 14th Baron lived. His family name was
Fitzherbert and he was born in 1926. To inherit a title, you MUST be
descended from the original creation.

The Complete Peerage will tell you that. If you haven't used it, it's
available in the best public libraries, is arranged by title rather
than surname, and gives chapter and verse on each holder of a
creation and the line of descent. Unlike Burke's, it includes
creations that have since died out, not just the genealogy of of
current peers or gentry. I have a suspicion that much of Jorge's
material is coming from the CP anyway, so that would enable you to do
a double-check.
>
> 3) If I subtract 390 (13x30), an estimated date of birth would be
1536. Baron Henry Stafford was born in 1501. He was married, of
course, to Ursula Pole giving his heirs Yorkist (Clarence) blood as
well.
>
> 4) Whilst the family were Lancastrian in their origins (the second
Duke, 1455-83, was Henry VII's second cousin born in the same year to
another Margaret Beaufort), they become Yorkist after 1483.

Well, what actually happened is that the first duke was killed
fighting for Lancaster at Northampton, his own eldest son Humphrey
having predeceased him. Humphrey's son Henry, the second duke, was
just small child when the title passed to him, and he became a royal
ward. He was, as we all know, married very young to Elizabeth
Woodville's sister Katherine, and spent his childhood after 1461 at
the Yorkist court. He had therefore never had a chance to be anything
other than a Yorkist before 1483. The only thing I don't know is what
he did during the Re-adeption; he would, however, only have been
about 16 at that time.

One Humphrey Stafford was executed in 1485 for defending Richard at
Bosworth; "tudorplace" is so large a database that I found him on
Tuesday and have lost him since.

The date and cause of execution are not quite accurate. Humphrey
Stafford and his brother Thomas actually mounted a rebellion in the
West Midlands in favour of the Earl of Warwick in the spring of 1486;
they were dragged from sanctuary on 11 May 1486, and Humphrey was
hanged, drawn and quarted at Tyburn.

Marie

>
> 5) The second Duke's name was definitely Henry. Some people have
thought him to be a Humphrey but this is a separate individual I have
described above.
>
>
>