Dates for the portraits

Lost my post again! Kathryn and anyone else who's interested, here are the dates for the various portraits, all posthumous. The original (or originals) is lost. I'm providing URLs to show where I got my information.)

Society of Antiquaries: Tree-ring dated to after 1510 http://makinghistory.sal.org.uk/page.php?cat=2 (scroll down to painting and click Read More and then Full Story)

Royal Collection: Tree-ring dated to 1515-1520 http://www.richardiii.net/2_4_0_riii_appearance.php

Broken Sword: Tree-ring dated to after 1550: http://makinghistory.sal.org.uk/page.php?cat=2 (scroll down to painting and click Read More and then Full Story)

National Portrait Gallery: Tree-ring dated to 1580s to 1590s:
http://www.npg.org.uk/research/programmes/making-art-in-tudor-britain/tudor-and-jacobean-painting-production-influences-and-patronage-december-2010/extended-abstracts-and-videos/evidence-from-portrait-sets-and-multiple-copies-richard-iii-in-focus.php

Italian School (late sixteenth century): http://www.bridgemanart.com/en-GB/asset/33724/italian-school-16th-century/portrait-of-richard-iii

If this message doesn't post, I'll give up!

Carol

Hi Carol,

Thank you for the post about Richard's hair colouring etc.I have received your post with the tree-ring dates and will at look them tomorrow as I can't click on them at the moment.

Kathryn x

--- In , <justcarol67@...> wrote:
>
> Lost my post again! Kathryn and anyone else who's interested, here are the dates for the various portraits, all posthumous. The original (or originals) is lost. I'm providing URLs to show where I got my information.)
>
> Society of Antiquaries: Tree-ring dated to after 1510 http://makinghistory.sal.org.uk/page.php?cat=2 (scroll down to painting and click Read More and then Full Story)
>
> Royal Collection: Tree-ring dated to 1515-1520 http://www.richardiii.net/2_4_0_riii_appearance.php
>
> Broken Sword: Tree-ring dated to after 1550: http://makinghistory.sal.org.uk/page.php?cat=2 (scroll down to painting and click Read More and then Full Story)
>
> National Portrait Gallery: Tree-ring dated to 1580s to 1590s:
> http://www.npg.org.uk/research/programmes/making-art-in-tudor-britain/tudor-and-jacobean-painting-production-influences-and-patronage-december-2010/extended-abstracts-and-videos/evidence-from-portrait-sets-and-multiple-copies-richard-iii-in-focus.php
>
> Italian School (late sixteenth century): http://www.bridgemanart.com/en-GB/asset/33724/italian-school-16th-century/portrait-of-richard-iii
>
> If this message doesn't post, I'll give up!
>
> Carol
>

Thank You, Carol,

for this compilation of the dates of the portraits.
Last year I posted the dates too, but this obviously made no big impression on anyone. So I am hopeful
that the facts about the portraits will finally seep into the consciousness of members in this Forum.These are simply hard facts that cannot be denied; and while I think everybody can pick his favorite portrait of Richard as she or he wishes; the historical evidence clearly points to the SOA portrait as being the most probable likeness.
Thanks also for the link to Making History. I always looked at the SOA-homepage till now, where they still show the uncleaned portrait.

Eva

Eva wrote:
"Thank You, Carol, for this compilation of the dates of the portraits.
Last year I posted the dates too, but this obviously made no big impression on anyone. So I am hopeful that the facts about the portraits will finally seep into the consciousness of members in this Forum.These are simply hard facts that cannot be denied; and while I think everybody can pick his favorite portrait of Richard as she or he wishes; the historical evidence clearly points to the SOA portrait as being the most probable likeness.
Thanks also for the link to Making History. I always looked at the SOA-homepage till now, where they still show the uncleaned portrait."

Carol responds:
You're welcome, Eva. But I'm afraid that I can't agree with your conclusion about the SoA being the best likeness. As you can see if you clicked on the links, at least two of the portraits (RC and NPG) had underlying traceries of what appears to be a still earlier portrait. the fact that the SoA has altered clothing and faces the wrong direction suggests that even the cleaned version was different in other respects from the lost original. I think our best bet would be a cleaned version of the RC portrait removing the distorted features and raised shoulder. Meanwhile, there's the unarguable fact that the NPG portrait (which lacks the RC's distortions) comes closest to the reconstructed face--and to the underlying tracery.

The main point is that none is an original and the earliest postdates Richard's death by at least twenty-five years, so even the best of them (and here the element of subjectivity is unavoidable) is not an exact likeness.

Carol, with apologies for the uncorrectable spacing in this post

Hi Eva,
Sorry if I missed your post about the dating of Richard's portraits.I'm not sure if I had joined then.Thanks to Carol for posting them recently. Have received your portaits via e-mail. Have definitely seen the first and the last but not sure about the second.The first one has similarities with regards to Richard's portraits but if it is him then it doesn't seem to be a good version.The second seens to be the same as the first unless I have the first one down loaded twice.The third one of the SOA is fabulous and I do love it..His eyes seem more grey than brown or blue.

Kathryn x

Sorry to have to reply on the forum and not direct but I can't upload new addresses at the moment.My daughter should be able to sort things at the week-end,apologies to others who have contacted me too,will be in touch as soon as possible.
Kathryn x

Hi Kathryn,
I am glad you finally got the pictures. The second should have been a line drawing after the NPG picture
made in the 19th century. But I the picture I wanted to show you most is the SOA, for it is a really good reproduction.
Eva

Hi Eva, it is really beautiful. It looks quite modern in style to me. Almost like a watercolour but this may be due to the pigmentation fading over time.I do wish he'd lived and been happy again and ruled the country well.
Kathryn x