Richard's son John

What is his proper moniker, anyway? John of Gloucester? John of
Pomfret/Pontefract?

Anyway, do we have any information as to when he was born? Was he
old enough to have fathered children before he was swept up by the
Tudor forces after Richard's death? And do we know how or where he
was captured?

I guess I'm intrigued by him because I know so little about him.

Katy

--- In , oregonkaty
<no_reply@y...> wrote:
> What is his proper moniker, anyway? John of Gloucester? John of
> Pomfret/Pontefract?

Both. He is referred to as both in Harley 433 - Gloucester because he
was Richard of Gloucester's son, and of Pomfret/Pontefract presumably
because that was his birthplace.
>
> Anyway, do we have any information as to when he was born?

None at all.

Was he
> old enough to have fathered children before he was swept up by the
> Tudor forces after Richard's death? And do we know how or where he
> was captured?

He seems to have simply been found in Calais (where Richard had sent
him some months earlier) after Bosworth, and taken. I would imagine
that Henry's men got to him as fast as word of the battle could
travel. I'm sorry to have to leave this one here. I'll be away for
the next two weeks. Will miss the forum. Bye all.

Marie

--- In , "marie" <marie@r...>
wrote:
> --- In , oregonkaty
> <no_reply@y...> wrote:
> > What is his proper moniker, anyway? John of Gloucester? John of
> > Pomfret/Pontefract?
>
> Both. He is referred to as both in Harley 433 - Gloucester because
he
> was Richard of Gloucester's son, and of Pomfret/Pontefract
presumably
> because that was his birthplace.
> >
> > Anyway, do we have any information as to when he was born?
>
> None at all.
>
> Was he
> > old enough to have fathered children before he was swept up by
the
> > Tudor forces after Richard's death? And do we know how or where
he
> > was captured?
>
> He seems to have simply been found in Calais (where Richard had
sent
> him some months earlier) after Bosworth, and taken. I would imagine
> that Henry's men got to him as fast as word of the battle could
> travel. I'm sorry to have to leave this one here. I'll be away for
> the next two weeks. Will miss the forum. Bye all.
>
> Marie

Hi,

I know a little bit about his son as I'm writing a film script about
Richard III and had to reseach individual characters.

He was born around 1470 so would have been about 15 by 1485, and he
was brought up at Middleham. He was knighted in 1483 and then on
March 11 1485 he was appointed Captain of Calais. (He was a royal
figurehead for the Calais council on a smaller scale than that of the
council of the North, governed by Richard's heir John De La Pole).
John of Gloucester also went to Calais in person with Robert
Brackenbury in 1485. He was captured 3 days after Bosworth,
presumably after fighting alongside his father, since he was old
enough to do so. It seems that he was imprisoned in the tower until
Perkin Warbeck's rebellion of which he was a conspirator. He was
executed along with Warwick in 1499. As far as I know he never
married.

Hope this helps.

Mim

--- In , mrm_bell
<no_reply@y...> wrote:
> --- In , "marie" <marie@r...>
> wrote:
> > --- In , oregonkaty
> > <no_reply@y...> wrote:
> > > What is his proper moniker, anyway? John of Gloucester? John
of
> > > Pomfret/Pontefract?
> >
> > Both. He is referred to as both in Harley 433 - Gloucester
because
> he
> > was Richard of Gloucester's son, and of Pomfret/Pontefract
> presumably
> > because that was his birthplace.
> > >
> > > Anyway, do we have any information as to when he was born?
> >
> > None at all.
> >
> > Was he
> > > old enough to have fathered children before he was swept up by
> the
> > > Tudor forces after Richard's death? And do we know how or
where
> he
> > > was captured?
> >
> > He seems to have simply been found in Calais (where Richard had
> sent
> > him some months earlier) after Bosworth, and taken. I would
imagine
> > that Henry's men got to him as fast as word of the battle could
> > travel. I'm sorry to have to leave this one here. I'll be away
for
> > the next two weeks. Will miss the forum. Bye all.
> >
> > Marie
>
> Hi,
>
> I know a little bit about his son as I'm writing a film script
about
> Richard III and had to reseach individual characters.
>
> He was born around 1470 so would have been about 15 by 1485, and he
> was brought up at Middleham. He was knighted in 1483 and then on
> March 11 1485 he was appointed Captain of Calais. (He was a royal
> figurehead for the Calais council on a smaller scale than that of
the
> council of the North, governed by Richard's heir John De La Pole).
> John of Gloucester also went to Calais in person with Robert
> Brackenbury in 1485. He was captured 3 days after Bosworth,
> presumably after fighting alongside his father, since he was old
> enough to do so. It seems that he was imprisoned in the tower until
> Perkin Warbeck's rebellion of which he was a conspirator. He was
> executed along with Warwick in 1499. As far as I know he never
> married.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> Mim

Hi, Mim. Nice to make contact. I've just got back from holiday so
catching up on missed messages.
My info on John of Gloucester comes from Peter Hammoond's resume of
the evidence in a past Ricardian. Could I possibly ask you your
source for john's date of birth and growing up at middleham, as I am
gathering info on the Yorkist scions for a work of my own?

Thanks in advance.

Marie

--- In , "marie" <marie@r...>
wrote:
>
> Hi, Mim. Nice to make contact. I've just got back from holiday so
> catching up on missed messages.
> My info on John of Gloucester comes from Peter Hammoond's resume of
> the evidence in a past Ricardian. Could I possibly ask you your
> source for john's date of birth and growing up at middleham, as I
am
> gathering info on the Yorkist scions for a work of my own?
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> Marie


Hi Marie,

I occassionally use the Directory of Royal Geneological Data (Brian
Tompsett) although I'm not sure if it works now?
http://www.dcs.hull.ac.uk/public/genealogy/royal/

I've recently found alot more factual information on both John and
Katherine from "Richard III, A Study of Service" by Rosemary Horrox.
This book just looks at the facts but isn't very pro Richard!

The books I have that best argue Richard's defence are The Mystery of
the Princes (Audrey Williamson) and Good King Richard (Jeremy Potter).

hope to talk to you later,
Mim