Fog at Barnet and Friar Bungay

I have come across a bizarre reference to Barnet. It's a claim that
a fourteenth (sic) century magician and necromancer called Friar
Bungay was responsible for raising the fog, thus aiding Edward IV's
victory. Was this a contemporary or near contemporary rumour? I
know accusations of sorcery were common as slanders of political
rivals in our period but I've never read about it before.

The only other reference I can find to this character is that there
is an Elizabethan play by Robert Greene called Friar Bacon and Friar
Bungay (written 1594). As Roger Bacon lived in the thirteenth
century, this definitely sounds like a complete work of fiction.

Can anyone tell me how and where this story about Friar Bungay
started?

Thanks in advance.

Joanne

--- In , "jotwo2003"
<jsummerill@s...> wrote:
>
> I have come across a bizarre reference to Barnet. It's a claim
that
> a fourteenth (sic) century magician and necromancer called Friar
> Bungay was responsible for raising the fog, thus aiding Edward IV's
> victory. Was this a contemporary or near contemporary rumour? I
> know accusations of sorcery were common as slanders of political
> rivals in our period but I've never read about it before.
>
> The only other reference I can find to this character is that there
> is an Elizabethan play by Robert Greene called Friar Bacon and
Friar
> Bungay (written 1594). As Roger Bacon lived in the thirteenth
> century, this definitely sounds like a complete work of fiction.
>
> Can anyone tell me how and where this story about Friar Bungay
> started?
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> Joanne

According to Jonathan Hughes (Edward IV, Arthurian Myths & Alchemy),
this story comes from Fabyan, so it is a little late. However, Fabyan
had been an apprentice of Thomas Cook (of the tapestry fame), and
Cook seems to have had an interest in alchmy as he had both sat on a
commission in 1457 to find alchemical means of solving Henry VI's
financial problems, and produced a MS containing some of Roger
Bacon's works.
Friar Bungay, according to Hughes, was an alias of one Robert Barker
from Bungay in Suffolk, and also called himself Frumitor. He was a
member of Edward's court, and Hughes thinks he may be the Robert
Barker who was admitted a fellow of Peterhouse in 1456 and died
befrore 1494. In November 1456 Barker began writing an alchemical
treatise, and was concerned with finding an elixir "that would
reconcile conflicting complexions in he human body and the body
politic, and 'bring peace between the elements so that they be fixed
and steadfast'." (p.53) He wrote other alchemical works too.

Fabyan recalled that the mist at Barnet had been roused by Friar
Bungay. Also, "Describing the bad weather that prevented Margaret
crossing the Channel to join forces with Warwick, Fabyan commented
that those ill-disposed to her explained the unfavourable wind which
detained her in France as a heavenly injunction against her return to
a land which she had already harmed so much. those well-favoured
interpreted it as a trick of the mysterious sorcerer Friar Bungay."
(p.232)

There's nowt so strange as fact. I believe that England's latter-day
white witches also got together to cloak the Dunkirk rescue
operations from German eyes. Oddly enough, the weather was I believe
the factor that made it all possible, the cloud cover being thick
enough, and just the right height, to allow perfect visibility to
those in the 'little boats' whilst shielding them completely from the
German planes overhead.
Or is this a fable?

Marie

--- In , "mariewalsh2003"
<marie@r...> wrote:
>
>
> According to Jonathan Hughes (Edward IV, Arthurian Myths &
Alchemy),
> this story comes from Fabyan, so it is a little late. However,
Fabyan
> had been an apprentice of Thomas Cook (of the tapestry fame), and
> Cook seems to have had an interest in alchmy as he had both sat on
a
> commission in 1457 to find alchemical means of solving Henry VI's
> financial problems, and produced a MS containing some of Roger
> Bacon's works.
> Friar Bungay, according to Hughes, was an alias of one Robert
Barker
> from Bungay in Suffolk, and also called himself Frumitor. He was a
> member of Edward's court, and Hughes thinks he may be the Robert
> Barker who was admitted a fellow of Peterhouse in 1456 and died
> befrore 1494. In November 1456 Barker began writing an alchemical
> treatise, and was concerned with finding an elixir "that would
> reconcile conflicting complexions in he human body and the body
> politic, and 'bring peace between the elements so that they be
fixed
> and steadfast'." (p.53) He wrote other alchemical works too.
>
> Fabyan recalled that the mist at Barnet had been roused by Friar
> Bungay. Also, "Describing the bad weather that prevented Margaret
> crossing the Channel to join forces with Warwick, Fabyan commented
> that those ill-disposed to her explained the unfavourable wind
which
> detained her in France as a heavenly injunction against her return
to
> a land which she had already harmed so much. those well-favoured
> interpreted it as a trick of the mysterious sorcerer Friar Bungay."
> (p.232)
>
> There's nowt so strange as fact. I believe that England's latter-
day
> white witches also got together to cloak the Dunkirk rescue
> operations from German eyes. Oddly enough, the weather was I
believe
> the factor that made it all possible, the cloud cover being thick
> enough, and just the right height, to allow perfect visibility to
> those in the 'little boats' whilst shielding them completely from
the
> German planes overhead.
> Or is this a fable?
>

Verrry interesting, Marie.

I have watched several documentaries on the influence of weather on
warfare, on the Weather Channel ere in the US. One concerned Dunkirk
and said essentially just what you did regarding the fog bank of just
the right depth and altidute above the sea.

Another involving WW II was the cloud cover over Hawaii on December
6, 1941, which prevented Japanese reconnaisance from learning that
the Amerian aircraft carriers had put out to sea and were not
in Pearl Harbor. The carriers were a major objective of the strike
force, and if the Japanese could have destroyed them in port, things
might have gone differently in the war. If the Japanese had known
that the carriers were out in the open sea, they might have postponed
the attack.

Another concerned the storm and heavy cloud cover over the Battle of
Midway in aso in WW II, which hid the size and location of the
Allied battlegroups and made the Japanese unwilling to risk their one
and only supercarrier

Yet another, and closer to our time, covered the defeat of the
Spanish Armada, chiefly by the storm which fortuitously blew up and
scattered the Spanish fleet.

Katy

--- In , oregonkaty
<no_reply@y...> wrote:
>
> --- In , "mariewalsh2003"
> <marie@r...> wrote:
> >
> >
> > According to Jonathan Hughes (Edward IV, Arthurian Myths &
> Alchemy),
> > this story comes from Fabyan, so it is a little late. However,
> Fabyan
> > had been an apprentice of Thomas Cook (of the tapestry fame), and
> > Cook seems to have had an interest in alchmy as he had both sat
on
> a
> > commission in 1457 to find alchemical means of solving Henry VI's
> > financial problems, and produced a MS containing some of Roger
> > Bacon's works.
> > Friar Bungay, according to Hughes, was an alias of one Robert
> Barker
> > from Bungay in Suffolk, and also called himself Frumitor. He was
a
> > member of Edward's court, and Hughes thinks he may be the Robert
> > Barker who was admitted a fellow of Peterhouse in 1456 and died
> > befrore 1494. In November 1456 Barker began writing an alchemical
> > treatise, and was concerned with finding an elixir "that would
> > reconcile conflicting complexions in he human body and the body
> > politic, and 'bring peace between the elements so that they be
> fixed
> > and steadfast'." (p.53) He wrote other alchemical works too.
> >
> > Fabyan recalled that the mist at Barnet had been roused by Friar
> > Bungay. Also, "Describing the bad weather that prevented Margaret
> > crossing the Channel to join forces with Warwick, Fabyan
commented
> > that those ill-disposed to her explained the unfavourable wind
> which
> > detained her in France as a heavenly injunction against her
return
> to
> > a land which she had already harmed so much. those well-favoured
> > interpreted it as a trick of the mysterious sorcerer Friar
Bungay."
> > (p.232)
> >
> > There's nowt so strange as fact. I believe that England's latter-
> day
> > white witches also got together to cloak the Dunkirk rescue
> > operations from German eyes. Oddly enough, the weather was I
> believe
> > the factor that made it all possible, the cloud cover being thick
> > enough, and just the right height, to allow perfect visibility to
> > those in the 'little boats' whilst shielding them completely from
> the
> > German planes overhead.
> > Or is this a fable?
> >
>
> Verrry interesting, Marie.
>
> I have watched several documentaries on the influence of weather on
> warfare, on the Weather Channel ere in the US. One concerned
Dunkirk
> and said essentially just what you did regarding the fog bank of
just
> the right depth and altidute above the sea.
>
> Another involving WW II was the cloud cover over Hawaii on December
> 6, 1941, which prevented Japanese reconnaisance from learning that
> the Amerian aircraft carriers had put out to sea and were not
> in Pearl Harbor. The carriers were a major objective of the strike
> force, and if the Japanese could have destroyed them in port,
things
> might have gone differently in the war. If the Japanese had known
> that the carriers were out in the open sea, they might have
postponed
> the attack.
>
> Another concerned the storm and heavy cloud cover over the Battle
of
> Midway in aso in WW II, which hid the size and location of the
> Allied battlegroups and made the Japanese unwilling to risk their
one
> and only supercarrier
>
> Yet another, and closer to our time, covered the defeat of the
> Spanish Armada, chiefly by the storm which fortuitously blew up and
> scattered the Spanish fleet.
>
> Katy

Yet another example is William the Conqueror being driven across
Yorkshire into Lancashire and wandering lost and feared dead in fog
or snow after attempting to be revenged upon the area around York and
Durham around 1070. Similarly the area was allegedly saved from
German attack during WW2 by the same intervention through weather of
St Cuthbert. I gather the saint was offended by the king's
(William's) desire to see his uncorrupted body and insistence that he
would execute the monks of Durham if this turned out to be a myth.
The story goes that he fled and wouldn't stop till he was outside the
see of Durham. I am not sure at the moment if the two Durham/William
events are one and the same or different occasions, but one involves
weather.
Brunhild

--- In , "jotwo2003"
<jsummerill@s...> wrote:
>
> I have come across a bizarre reference to Barnet. It's a claim
that
> a fourteenth (sic) century magician and necromancer called Friar
> Bungay was responsible for raising the fog, thus aiding Edward IV's
> victory. Was this a contemporary or near contemporary rumour?

(I've been trying to create a new post on this subject, but Yahoo is
thwarting me, so I'll use Judith's post as a springnboard.)

Two more instances of weather profoundly affecting turning points of
English history are the sinking of the White Ship during an attempted
crossing of the English Channel in November 1120. The cause seems to
have ben a gale that wrecked it on the coast of Normandy, possibly
compounded by a drunk captain and, as usual, sorcery. Killed in the
wreck were Henry I's only legitimate son, three bastard sons and a
daughter. The loss of Henry's only heir led to decades of fighting
over the crown.

On the other hand, in Ocrober 1066, William I's invading fleet was
caught in another of the ever-popular Channel storms, but the weather
cleared and gave his forces an unexpectedly fast and fair crossing,
much to the surprise of Harold Godwinson, who was busy up north with
Harold Hardrada's army at Stamford Bridge.

Katy