Re: Catherine of Aragon

Thanks, Maria!

Catherine of Aragon was born just a few months after the Battle of
Bosworth Field, then. To think how differently her life would have turned
out if Richard had won! Just two years earlier, her mother Isabella had
written a warm letter of welcome to Richard III...does that letter still
exist somewhere? Is it possible that any of Richard's letters to her
still survive in Spain?

Dec. 16 as Beethoven's birthday may be just an estimate, based on his
baptism Dec. 17, as it was said to be traditional to baptize on the day
following birth, but this may not have been a hard and fast rule. Still,
Dec.16 works as an approximate date. It's easy to remember that he
was born in 1770 ever since I read of 31-year-old Mozart's listening to
17-year-old Beethoven playing the *piano in 1787 in Vienna and making
the prediction that Beethoven would write music worth listening to.
(These numbers can only be accurate if the concert occurred in the
last two weeks of December, 1787.) But, no matter, Beethoven's work
was pure genius, the more so for his being deaf. Even though the
movie "Immortal Beloved" is (in the way of movies) highly fictionalized,
there are truths in it about his character and life, and Gary Oldman,
IMHO, did a terrific acting job.

In any movies based on Jane Austen's novels, I'm always checking to
see if the music played would have been contemporary to Austen's time.
Beethoven was contemporary to Austen (1775-1817), so it works as a good
fit. Mozart works, too.

When visiting Jane Austen's grave in Winchester, I hadn't realized that
King Canute, or Cnut, had been buried there along with Queen Emma.

Getting back to your point, though, some great creative minds came along
in December. I think Steven Spielberg's birthday is tomorrow or the next
day.

Re: Beethoven, just last October (13) it was reported that an authentic 1825
Beethoven manuscript called Grosse Fuge was found by a Pennsylvania librarian
at the Palmer Theological Seminary in Wynnewood, PA in July 2005. It had
been missing for 115 years, according to Wikipedia, which also said it was
auctioned December 1 for GBP 1.12 million, or 1.95 million US dollars. In
1890,
it had been sold at auction in Berlin to a Cincinnati industrialist. etc
etc.
Hmm, will have to see if Sotheby's has a website with info about this.

LML,
Pam

*p.s. I'm not aware of how the transistion from harpsichords to pianos took
place.
-------------------------------------------------------------
In a message dated 12/16/2005 6:42:46 AM Mountain Standard Time,
ejbronte@... writes:

Today is the birthday of Catherine of Aragon, born in 1485.

She's in good company because it's also Jane Austen's birthday and
Beethoven's.

Maria
elena@...

--- In , PamelaJButler@a...
wrote:
>
>
> Thanks, Maria!
>
> Catherine of Aragon was born just a few months after the Battle of
> Bosworth Field, then. To think how differently her life would
have turned
> out if Richard had won! Just two years earlier, her mother
Isabella had
> written a warm letter of welcome to Richard III...does that letter
still
> exist somewhere? Is it possible that any of Richard's letters to
her
> still survive in Spain?

The thing I always remember about Catherine is that her marriage with
Prince Arthur was "made in blood" in that the Spanish court refused
to sanction the marriage until the Earl of Warwick (Clarence's son)
had been executed, since Warwick clearly had a much better claim to
the throne than Arthur or his brother Henry.

> When visiting Jane Austen's grave in Winchester, I hadn't realized
that
> King Canute, or Cnut, had been buried there along with Queen Emma.

Many of the pre-conquest Kings were buried at Winchester, which was
the Wessex and subsequently English capital city. The bones are
actually held in large chests which are on wooden panels near the
roof of the cathedral. Unfortunately during the reformation the
chests were broken open and the bones used to play cricket with.
They thus got jumbled up and nobody knows which set of bones belongs
to which King.

for a bit of interesting history regarding the discovery of the new world, google using these words...
cabot world pope bull

careful what you sift thru, but there are items of truth, even in the conspiracy type sites

catherine's parents were isabel and ferdinand who backed columbus's voyages.
catherine's father in law was henry vii who backed john cabot...who actually touched north american/solid land before the spanish did. columbus and cohorts were still floating around islands in the carribean when canada was "offically" discovered.

at the time of these voyages the borgia pope, also a spaniard issued a papal bull declaring all of the new world was to belong to spain and portugal.

ergo, i wonder if the marital woes of henry viii and catherine were somewhat influenced by the events of the new world. h8's daughter elizabeth certainly had her problems with the spanish.

roslyn

theblackprussian <theblackprussian@...> wrote:
--- In , PamelaJButler@a...
wrote:
>
>
> Thanks, Maria!
>
> Catherine of Aragon was born just a few months after the Battle of
> Bosworth Field, then. To think how differently her life would
have turned
> out if Richard had won! Just two years earlier, her mother
Isabella had
> written a warm letter of welcome to Richard III...does that letter
still
> exist somewhere? Is it possible that any of Richard's letters to
her
> still survive in Spain?

The thing I always remember about Catherine is that her marriage with
Prince Arthur was "made in blood" in that the Spanish court refused
to sanction the marriage until the Earl of Warwick (Clarence's son)
had been executed, since Warwick clearly had a much better claim to
the throne than Arthur or his brother Henry.

> When visiting Jane Austen's grave in Winchester, I hadn't realized
that
> King Canute, or Cnut, had been buried there along with Queen Emma.

Many of the pre-conquest Kings were buried at Winchester, which was
the Wessex and subsequently English capital city. The bones are
actually held in large chests which are on wooden panels near the
roof of the cathedral. Unfortunately during the reformation the
chests were broken open and the bones used to play cricket with.
They thus got jumbled up and nobody knows which set of bones belongs
to which King.





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--- In , "theblackprussian"
<theblackprussian@y...> wrote:



> The thing I always remember about Catherine is that her marriage with
> Prince Arthur was "made in blood" in that the Spanish court refused
> to sanction the marriage until the Earl of Warwick (Clarence's son)
> had been executed, since Warwick clearly had a much better claim to
> the throne than Arthur or his brother Henry.



Richard III's bastard son John was also executed about that time,
having been imprisoned since shortly after Bosworth. Guess Henry VII
was afraid that even an illegitimate Plantagenet might be preferred
over the Tudor line.

Katy

--- In , fayre rose
<fayreroze@y...> wrote:
>
> for a bit of interesting history regarding the discovery of the new
world,


I have read that before Christopher Columbus approached Ferdinand and
Isabella for backing for his venture to find a new sea route to the Far
East, his brother Diego had an appointment to present the idea to Henry
VII. Henry VII did not keep the appointment. Even if he had, I doubt
Tudor would have pried open his treasury to finance the mission. But
Richard III might have -- he was interested in innovation -- and
then "the river of gold" from the New World might have flowed to Englad
rather than Spain.

Katy