Fwd: TMR 06.03.02, Hicks, Edward IV (Ford)

Dear all,

There's been some conversation on this list about
Hicks' book on Anne Neville and the way in which it
might be received by the scholary community.

As one datapoint, here's a scholarly review of his
earlier offering on Edward IV. In her generally
favorable review, Ford observes that it is difficult
sometimes to tell whether Hicks is speaking in his own
voice or relaying the opinions of fifteenth- through
twenty-first century historians, a difficulty I had
with the Richard III volume of his released in the
early 1990s.

--- The Medieval Review <tmr-l@...> wrote:

> Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2006 10:18:31 -0500
> From: The Medieval Review <tmr-l@...>
> Subject: TMR 06.03.02, Hicks, Edward IV (Ford)
> To: tmr-l@...
>
> Hicks, Michael. <i>Edward IV</i>. Reputations.
> London: Hodder
> Arnold and New York: Oxford University Press, 2004.
> Pp. xiii,
> 273. $29.95. ISBN 0-340-76006-0 (pb).
>
> Reviewed by Lisa Ford
> Yale University
> drllford@...
>
>
> The stated purpose of this book, part of the
> Reputations series
> from Arnold Publishing, is to examine the person in
> question
> via a range of representations, some of striking
> incompatibility, in an attempt to give the reader a
> sumptuous
> feast of opinion on a particular notable person in
> history.
> This book succeeds admirably in that regard, and
> will serve a
> highly useful purpose in the libraries of late
> medieval
> scholars and students as both a handy reference to
> the works of
> historians and chroniclers of Edward IV, and a
> statement of the
> state of play in historical discourse on Edward at
> any point up
> to the start of the 21st century.
>
> Hicks appears quite well-acquainted with the
> historiography he
> seeks to elucidate, displaying knowledge of the wide
> range of
> primary and secondary sources that provide varying
> perspectives
> of Edward IV, from such early manuscripts as the
> <i>Somnium
> Vigilantis</i> to Elizabethan verse tragedies to
> <i>1066 and
> All That</i>. He canvasses the early providential
> themes of
> Edward IV's historiography, the first serious
> Yorkist
> biographies by Buck and Habington, the influences of
> the
> Enlightenment, Romantic, and constitutional
> scholars, and the
> later 20th century flurry of work on Edward IV,
> finishing with
> the most recent, and novel, approach by Jonathan
> Hughes. This
> project occupies the first five chapters; Hicks then
> shifts to
> an examination of various issues such as Edward's
> marriage,
> finances, wars, and relations with the nobility.
>
> Hicks approaches his task in a scrupulously pro-con
> style, with
> chapters composed of sections in which the narrative
> necessary
> to set the scene is interspersed with, or followed
> by, Hicks
> presentation of the fors and againsts in regard to a
> particular
> issue. Indeed, Hicks frequently uses that exact
> language: in
> Chapter Three, sections are explicitly titled
> Against and For
> and pit the views of Philippe de Commynes, a
> Flemish-born
> councilor and servant of both Charles the Bold and
> Louis XI,
> against those of the Crowland chronicler. Equally
> scrupulously,
> throughout the book Hicks delivers cautions to the
> reader and
> historian regarding the biases of sources, the
> presence of
> equal, but conflicting, views which are a natural
> part of
> historical discourse, and the presence of
> partisanship taken to
> extremes from Edward's time period forward.
>
> The chapters are rich in detail, and admirably
> canvass the
> chroniclers and historians who have contributed to
> Edward's
> reputation. Hicks intersperses candid comments on
> the
> shortcomings or prejudices that may prevail on
> behalf of
> ancient chroniclers, such as the pointed reminder
> that Commynes
> wrote his memoirs as a disappointed man, whose
> treachery had
> not borne the fruits in rank, power or length of
> service that
> had been hoped, a comment more relevant to Commynes
> judgment of
> Charles VIII, but still pertinent. Hicks is equally
> pungent
> about modern commentators, such as his comment after
> one
> quotation that anachronistic prejudice wars here
> with
> penetrating insights. Both the text and the
> footnotes give the
> interested reader treasure trove from which to
> follow up on
> comments or observations that intrigue, and enable
> one to
> quickly sort the standard bearers of the pro- and
> con-Edwardian
> theories and perspectives.
>
> Hicks interlards his prose with modern
> colloquialisms, such as
> a reference to Yorkist spin doctors, or Henry VI's
> credit
> rating. He also provides some compelling turns of
> phrase, such
> as rebels being hanged by the purse or
> characterizing some of
> Edward's financial maneuvers as a consummately
> successful
> confidence trick. His style is fluid and highly
> readable, but
> there are points in which even the experienced
> scholar may
> experience momentary confusion, as it is not always
> immediately
> clear whether the commentary being made is ironic,
> part of a
> deliberately chosen modern or historical viewpoint,
> or a
> straightforward view of the author's. Hicks may
> launch into a
> section by matter-of-factly laying out views which
> one comes to
> realize, as one reads on, are deliberately negative
> or positive
> perspectives on the issue at hand, after which he
> slides almost
> seamlessly into the opposing views. Thus, a close
> and sustained
> reading of the text is essential in order not to
> miss the
> point, and the book is probably more easily ingested
> by a
> scholar already familiar with the subject, than by
> an
> undergraduate student coming to it cold.
>
> Hicks' control of the authorial viewpoint is
> admirable. His
> prose conveys the gaze of an author standing back
> from the
> parade of history and historiography and describing
> the passage
> of events through the eyes of their commentators,
> even to the
> section in which Hicks comments upon his own work in
> the third
> person. He has definite opinions, which emerge
> either directly
> or indirectly, and to which he sticks, even while
> elucidating
> other points of view, but he gives each person's
> opinion its
> due. His genealogy of the scholarly House of
> McFarlane is as
> intriguing as his commentary on their work, and
> students
> attempting to get a handle on the arguments will
> find this
> section a ready guide as to where modern historians
> line up
> regarding Edward IV. Hicks critiques are politic,
> though he
> reiterates more than once the point that modern
> historians must
> work from a comprehension of the views expressed in
> the
> historical period under consideration, rather than
> override
> them with contemporary judgments. Hicks dismisses
> unequivocally
> the insertion of modern standards for medieval ones
> as
> anachronistic and disqualified as history.
>
> The volume could have benefited from a final
> editorial pass to
> catch scattered small typos, but such is a minor
> point compared
> to the enjoyment and satisfaction of reading this
> book. With
> the current interest in personal myth,
> representation, and
> image as related to historical figures, which has
> generated
> such scholarly volumes as <i>The Myth of
> Elizabeth</i>, edited
> by Thomas S. Freeman and Susan Doran, or such
> popular websites
> as <i>William Wallace: The Truth Behind the Man</i>,
> this book
> should prove of great interest to those wanting a
> complete
> parsing of the contributions to Edward IV's
> historiography
> close at hand. It will make a profound contribution
> to the
> breaking of Yorkist myths related to Edward, both
> those
> generated by ancient commentators and those being
> created anew
> by modern historians. Nothing is sacred and if one
> is not
> content with the summations and opinions offered by
> Hicks, one
> knows exactly where to go to read up and make one's
> own
> assessments.
>
>

I've read three of Hicks books, and I think the review is a fair
assessment of his modus operandi. It is for this reason that, when
someone discusses a point that Hicks has made, I want to see quotes and
context. I find he sometimes uses the rhetorical device of setting up an
argument in order to shoot it down. If we don't read him carefully
enough, we may miss his point.

Laura Blanchard wrote:
> Dear all,
>
> There's been some conversation on this list about
> Hicks' book on Anne Neville and the way in which it
> might be received by the scholary community.
>
> As one datapoint, here's a scholarly review of his
> earlier offering on Edward IV. In her generally
> favorable review, Ford observes that it is difficult
> sometimes to tell whether Hicks is speaking in his own
> voice or relaying the opinions of fifteenth- through
> twenty-first century historians, a difficulty I had
> with the Richard III volume of his released in the
> early 1990s.
>
> --- The Medieval Review <tmr-l@...> wrote:
>
> > Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2006 10:18:31 -0500
> > From: The Medieval Review <tmr-l@...>
> > Subject: TMR 06.03.02, Hicks, Edward IV (Ford)
> > To: tmr-l@...
> >
> > Hicks, Michael. <i>Edward IV</i>. Reputations.
> > London: Hodder
> > Arnold and New York: Oxford University Press, 2004.
> > Pp. xiii,
> > 273. $29.95. ISBN 0-340-76006-0 (pb).
> >
> > Reviewed by Lisa Ford
> > Yale University
> > drllford@...
> >
> >
> > The stated purpose of this book, part of the
> > Reputations series
> > from Arnold Publishing, is to examine the person in
> > question
> > via a range of representations, some of striking
> > incompatibility, in an attempt to give the reader a
> > sumptuous
> > feast of opinion on a particular notable person in
> > history.
> > This book succeeds admirably in that regard, and
> > will serve a
> > highly useful purpose in the libraries of late
> > medieval
> > scholars and students as both a handy reference to
> > the works of
> > historians and chroniclers of Edward IV, and a
> > statement of the
> > state of play in historical discourse on Edward at
> > any point up
> > to the start of the 21st century.
> >
> > Hicks appears quite well-acquainted with the
> > historiography he
> > seeks to elucidate, displaying knowledge of the wide
> > range of
> > primary and secondary sources that provide varying
> > perspectives
> > of Edward IV, from such early manuscripts as the
> > <i>Somnium
> > Vigilantis</i> to Elizabethan verse tragedies to
> > <i>1066 and
> > All That</i>. He canvasses the early providential
> > themes of
> > Edward IV's historiography, the first serious
> > Yorkist
> > biographies by Buck and Habington, the influences of
> > the
> > Enlightenment, Romantic, and constitutional
> > scholars, and the
> > later 20th century flurry of work on Edward IV,
> > finishing with
> > the most recent, and novel, approach by Jonathan
> > Hughes. This
> > project occupies the first five chapters; Hicks then
> > shifts to
> > an examination of various issues such as Edward's
> > marriage,
> > finances, wars, and relations with the nobility.
> >
> > Hicks approaches his task in a scrupulously pro-con
> > style, with
> > chapters composed of sections in which the narrative
> > necessary
> > to set the scene is interspersed with, or followed
> > by, Hicks
> > presentation of the fors and againsts in regard to a
> > particular
> > issue. Indeed, Hicks frequently uses that exact
> > language: in
> > Chapter Three, sections are explicitly titled
> > Against and For
> > and pit the views of Philippe de Commynes, a
> > Flemish-born
> > councilor and servant of both Charles the Bold and
> > Louis XI,
> > against those of the Crowland chronicler. Equally
> > scrupulously,
> > throughout the book Hicks delivers cautions to the
> > reader and
> > historian regarding the biases of sources, the
> > presence of
> > equal, but conflicting, views which are a natural
> > part of
> > historical discourse, and the presence of
> > partisanship taken to
> > extremes from Edward's time period forward.
> >
> > The chapters are rich in detail, and admirably
> > canvass the
> > chroniclers and historians who have contributed to
> > Edward's
> > reputation. Hicks intersperses candid comments on
> > the
> > shortcomings or prejudices that may prevail on
> > behalf of
> > ancient chroniclers, such as the pointed reminder
> > that Commynes
> > wrote his memoirs as a disappointed man, whose
> > treachery had
> > not borne the fruits in rank, power or length of
> > service that
> > had been hoped, a comment more relevant to Commynes
> > judgment of
> > Charles VIII, but still pertinent. Hicks is equally
> > pungent
> > about modern commentators, such as his comment after
> > one
> > quotation that anachronistic prejudice wars here
> > with
> > penetrating insights. Both the text and the
> > footnotes give the
> > interested reader treasure trove from which to
> > follow up on
> > comments or observations that intrigue, and enable
> > one to
> > quickly sort the standard bearers of the pro- and
> > con-Edwardian
> > theories and perspectives.
> >
> > Hicks interlards his prose with modern
> > colloquialisms, such as
> > a reference to Yorkist spin doctors, or Henry VI's
> > credit
> > rating. He also provides some compelling turns of
> > phrase, such
> > as rebels being hanged by the purse or
> > characterizing some of
> > Edward's financial maneuvers as a consummately
> > successful
> > confidence trick. His style is fluid and highly
> > readable, but
> > there are points in which even the experienced
> > scholar may
> > experience momentary confusion, as it is not always
> > immediately
> > clear whether the commentary being made is ironic,
> > part of a
> > deliberately chosen modern or historical viewpoint,
> > or a
> > straightforward view of the author's. Hicks may
> > launch into a
> > section by matter-of-factly laying out views which
> > one comes to
> > realize, as one reads on, are deliberately negative
> > or positive
> > perspectives on the issue at hand, after which he
> > slides almost
> > seamlessly into the opposing views. Thus, a close
> > and sustained
> > reading of the text is essential in order not to
> > miss the
> > point, and the book is probably more easily ingested
> > by a
> > scholar already familiar with the subject, than by
> > an
> > undergraduate student coming to it cold.
> >
> > Hicks' control of the authorial viewpoint is
> > admirable. His
> > prose conveys the gaze of an author standing back
> > from the
> > parade of history and historiography and describing
> > the passage
> > of events through the eyes of their commentators,
> > even to the
> > section in which Hicks comments upon his own work in
> > the third
> > person. He has definite opinions, which emerge
> > either directly
> > or indirectly, and to which he sticks, even while
> > elucidating
> > other points of view, but he gives each person's
> > opinion its
> > due. His genealogy of the scholarly House of
> > McFarlane is as
> > intriguing as his commentary on their work, and
> > students
> > attempting to get a handle on the arguments will
> > find this
> > section a ready guide as to where modern historians
> > line up
> > regarding Edward IV. Hicks critiques are politic,
> > though he
> > reiterates more than once the point that modern
> > historians must
> > work from a comprehension of the views expressed in
> > the
> > historical period under consideration, rather than
> > override
> > them with contemporary judgments. Hicks dismisses
> > unequivocally
> > the insertion of modern standards for medieval ones
> > as
> > anachronistic and disqualified as history.
> >
> > The volume could have benefited from a final
> > editorial pass to
> > catch scattered small typos, but such is a minor
> > point compared
> > to the enjoyment and satisfaction of reading this
> > book. With
> > the current interest in personal myth,
> > representation, and
> > image as related to historical figures, which has
> > generated
> > such scholarly volumes as <i>The Myth of
> > Elizabeth</i>, edited
> > by Thomas S. Freeman and Susan Doran, or such
> > popular websites
> > as <i>William Wallace: The Truth Behind the Man</i>,
> > this book
> > should prove of great interest to those wanting a
> > complete
> > parsing of the contributions to Edward IV's
> > historiography
> > close at hand. It will make a profound contribution
> > to the
> > breaking of Yorkist myths related to Edward, both
> > those
> > generated by ancient commentators and those being
> > created anew
> > by modern historians. Nothing is sacred and if one
> > is not
> > content with the summations and opinions offered by
> > Hicks, one
> > knows exactly where to go to read up and make one's
> > own
> > assessments.
> >
> >
>
>
>
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--- In , Laura Blanchard
<lblanchard@...> wrote:
>

>
> --- The Medieval Review <tmr-l@...> wrote:
>
> > Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2006 10:18:31 -0500
> > From: The Medieval Review <tmr-l@...>
> > Subject: TMR 06.03.02, Hicks, Edward IV (Ford)
> > To: tmr-l@...
> >
> > Hicks, Michael. <i>Edward IV</i>. Reputations.
> > London: Hodder
> > Arnold and New York: Oxford University Press, 2004.
> > Pp. xiii,
> > 273. $29.95. ISBN 0-340-76006-0 (pb).
> >
> > Reviewed by Lisa Ford
> > Yale University
> > drllford@...

Hicks critiques are politic,
> > though he
> > reiterates more than once the point that modern
> > historians must
> > work from a comprehension of the views expressed in
> > the
> > historical period under consideration, rather than
> > override
> > them with contemporary judgments. Hicks dismisses
> > unequivocally
> > the insertion of modern standards for medieval ones
> > as
> > anachronistic and disqualified as history.


Except when he does it? Sounds like a case of "do as I say, not as
I do."

I"m not very comfortable with the way Hicks evidently constructed
this biography, and possibly his others. Gathering up every
available fact about a subject is wonderful, but simply thumping them
all down on the table is less wonderful, in my opinion. The review
says that many of the "facts" directly contradict each other (thus
the quotes...they can't both be facts) but Hicks only sometimes
attempts to sort them out as to which is likelier to be correct.

The difference between a collection and an accumulation lies in
presentation. From this review it looks like Hicks has a heap of
research which he strolls through, pontificating on his own opinions.

The bad thing about a bad book done by a prominent person is that
then it has "been done" and there is less interest and room on the
bookshelf and in the publisher's inventory for another look at the
subject.

Katy

then..what needs to be done is several letters written to the publisher clearly indicating what errors hicks or any other author has made..that way the door is left a tad open for better/more accurate research.

don't attack the author..attack his message. use facts vs opinion.

but the bottom line is the publisher is going after the bottom line..the ka-ching of the cash register.

regards
roslyn

oregonkaty <[email protected]> wrote:
--- In , Laura Blanchard
<lblanchard@...> wrote:
>

>
> --- The Medieval Review <tmr-l@...> wrote:
>
> > Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2006 10:18:31 -0500
> > From: The Medieval Review <tmr-l@...>
> > Subject: TMR 06.03.02, Hicks, Edward IV (Ford)
> > To: tmr-l@...
> >
> > Hicks, Michael. <i>Edward IV</i>. Reputations.
> > London: Hodder
> > Arnold and New York: Oxford University Press, 2004.
> > Pp. xiii,
> > 273. $29.95. ISBN 0-340-76006-0 (pb).
> >
> > Reviewed by Lisa Ford
> > Yale University
> > drllford@...

Hicks critiques are politic,
> > though he
> > reiterates more than once the point that modern
> > historians must
> > work from a comprehension of the views expressed in
> > the
> > historical period under consideration, rather than
> > override
> > them with contemporary judgments. Hicks dismisses
> > unequivocally
> > the insertion of modern standards for medieval ones
> > as
> > anachronistic and disqualified as history.


Except when he does it? Sounds like a case of "do as I say, not as
I do."

I"m not very comfortable with the way Hicks evidently constructed
this biography, and possibly his others. Gathering up every
available fact about a subject is wonderful, but simply thumping them
all down on the table is less wonderful, in my opinion. The review
says that many of the "facts" directly contradict each other (thus
the quotes...they can't both be facts) but Hicks only sometimes
attempts to sort them out as to which is likelier to be correct.

The difference between a collection and an accumulation lies in
presentation. From this review it looks like Hicks has a heap of
research which he strolls through, pontificating on his own opinions.

The bad thing about a bad book done by a prominent person is that
then it has "been done" and there is less interest and room on the
bookshelf and in the publisher's inventory for another look at the
subject.

Katy






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Agreed.

fayre rose wrote:
> then..what needs to be done is several letters written to the
> publisher clearly indicating what errors hicks or any other author has
> made..that way the door is left a tad open for better/more accurate
> research.
>
> don't attack the author..attack his message. use facts vs opinion.
>
> but the bottom line is the publisher is going after the bottom
> line..the ka-ching of the cash register.
>
> regards
> roslyn
>
> oregonkaty <[email protected]> wrote:
> --- In , Laura Blanchard
> <lblanchard@...> wrote:
> >
>
> >
> > --- The Medieval Review <tmr-l@...> wrote:
> >
> > > Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2006 10:18:31 -0500
> > > From: The Medieval Review <tmr-l@...>
> > > Subject: TMR 06.03.02, Hicks, Edward IV (Ford)
> > > To: tmr-l@...
> > >
> > > Hicks, Michael. <i>Edward IV</i>. Reputations.
> > > London: Hodder
> > > Arnold and New York: Oxford University Press, 2004.
> > > Pp. xiii,
> > > 273. $29.95. ISBN 0-340-76006-0 (pb).
> > >
> > > Reviewed by Lisa Ford
> > > Yale University
> > > drllford@...
>
> Hicks critiques are politic,
> > > though he
> > > reiterates more than once the point that modern
> > > historians must
> > > work from a comprehension of the views expressed in
> > > the
> > > historical period under consideration, rather than
> > > override
> > > them with contemporary judgments. Hicks dismisses
> > > unequivocally
> > > the insertion of modern standards for medieval ones
> > > as
> > > anachronistic and disqualified as history.
>
>
> Except when he does it? Sounds like a case of "do as I say, not as
> I do."
>
> I"m not very comfortable with the way Hicks evidently constructed
> this biography, and possibly his others. Gathering up every
> available fact about a subject is wonderful, but simply thumping them
> all down on the table is less wonderful, in my opinion. The review
> says that many of the "facts" directly contradict each other (thus
> the quotes...they can't both be facts) but Hicks only sometimes
> attempts to sort them out as to which is likelier to be correct.
>
> The difference between a collection and an accumulation lies in
> presentation. From this review it looks like Hicks has a heap of
> research which he strolls through, pontificating on his own opinions.
>
> The bad thing about a bad book done by a prominent person is that
> then it has "been done" and there is less interest and room on the
> bookshelf and in the publisher's inventory for another look at the
> subject.
>
> Katy
>
>
>
>
>
>
> SPONSORED LINKS
> United kingdom calling card United kingdom flower delivery
> Call united kingdom United kingdom florist United kingdom phone
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> Call united kingdom
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> United kingdom hotel
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