John de Warenne
John de Warenne
2006-03-25 20:03:22
This recent discussion of the Duke of York and Cecily Neville reminds
me somewhat of the situation of John de Warenne, Earl of Surrey in the
late 13th/early 14th centuries. (He is depicted, though in the wrong
livery, in Braveheart.) He married Jeanne of Bar, a granddaughter of
Edward I, who had a lot of property and connections. He spent very
little time with her -- evidently they couldn't stand each other -- but
remained married to her for the rest of his life. He had no legitimate
children though he had seven bastard sons by his mistresses. He was
the only son of an only son and he was the end of his line...when he
died the earldom passed to his nephew Richard FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel.
Katy
me somewhat of the situation of John de Warenne, Earl of Surrey in the
late 13th/early 14th centuries. (He is depicted, though in the wrong
livery, in Braveheart.) He married Jeanne of Bar, a granddaughter of
Edward I, who had a lot of property and connections. He spent very
little time with her -- evidently they couldn't stand each other -- but
remained married to her for the rest of his life. He had no legitimate
children though he had seven bastard sons by his mistresses. He was
the only son of an only son and he was the end of his line...when he
died the earldom passed to his nephew Richard FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel.
Katy
Re: John de Warenne
2006-03-27 17:01:14
I'm not sure the FitzAlans ever held the Earldom of Surrey. They
always bore the title Earl of Arundle in right of their Albini
ancestors.
The Warenne estates were considered to have escheated, and were
divided into three parcels:
The West country lands went to the Montagues to help justify their
Earldom of Salisbury; the south eastern estates (Reigate, Lewes,
Castle Acre, and Bromfield in Wales) went to the FitzAlans and were
subsequently inherited by the Mowbrays and thence the Howards, while
the northern lands (Sandal, Conisboro, Grantham and Stamford) formed
the core of the territories which went to form the patrimony of the
House of York.
The Howards bore the title Earl of Surrey, but this is officially a
later creation rather than a direct inheritance.
--- In , oregonkaty
<no_reply@...> wrote:
>
> This recent discussion of the Duke of York and Cecily Neville
reminds
> me somewhat of the situation of John de Warenne, Earl of Surrey in
the
> late 13th/early 14th centuries. (He is depicted, though in the
wrong
> livery, in Braveheart.) He married Jeanne of Bar, a granddaughter
of
> Edward I, who had a lot of property and connections. He spent very
> little time with her -- evidently they couldn't stand each other --
but
> remained married to her for the rest of his life. He had no
legitimate
> children though he had seven bastard sons by his mistresses. He
was
> the only son of an only son and he was the end of his line...when
he
> died the earldom passed to his nephew Richard FitzAlan, Earl of
Arundel.
>
> Katy
>
always bore the title Earl of Arundle in right of their Albini
ancestors.
The Warenne estates were considered to have escheated, and were
divided into three parcels:
The West country lands went to the Montagues to help justify their
Earldom of Salisbury; the south eastern estates (Reigate, Lewes,
Castle Acre, and Bromfield in Wales) went to the FitzAlans and were
subsequently inherited by the Mowbrays and thence the Howards, while
the northern lands (Sandal, Conisboro, Grantham and Stamford) formed
the core of the territories which went to form the patrimony of the
House of York.
The Howards bore the title Earl of Surrey, but this is officially a
later creation rather than a direct inheritance.
--- In , oregonkaty
<no_reply@...> wrote:
>
> This recent discussion of the Duke of York and Cecily Neville
reminds
> me somewhat of the situation of John de Warenne, Earl of Surrey in
the
> late 13th/early 14th centuries. (He is depicted, though in the
wrong
> livery, in Braveheart.) He married Jeanne of Bar, a granddaughter
of
> Edward I, who had a lot of property and connections. He spent very
> little time with her -- evidently they couldn't stand each other --
but
> remained married to her for the rest of his life. He had no
legitimate
> children though he had seven bastard sons by his mistresses. He
was
> the only son of an only son and he was the end of his line...when
he
> died the earldom passed to his nephew Richard FitzAlan, Earl of
Arundel.
>
> Katy
>