Weir's Prose
Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 00:57:27
Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An Incestuous
Passion):
* In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she resembled
her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large breasts...
* By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick woman,
unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for this
world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate with
[Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
* With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death of
Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---began
to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
* Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he, too,
had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
Passion):
* In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she resembled
her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large breasts...
* By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick woman,
unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for this
world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate with
[Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
* With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death of
Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---began
to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
* Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he, too,
had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 01:13:36
I guess we could sum up Elizabeth of York as a woman with big boobs and
enormous advantages: sort of the Jessica Simpson of her day. Wonder if
Elizabeth knew what Buffalo wings were.
http://www.saidwhat.co.uk/quotes/celebrity/jessica_simpson
Bill Barber wrote:
>
> Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An Incestuous
> Passion):
>
> * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she resembled
> her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large breasts...
>
> * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick woman,
> unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for this
> world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate with
> [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
>
> * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death of
> Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---began
> to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
>
> * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he, too,
> had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
>
> That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
>
>
>
>
enormous advantages: sort of the Jessica Simpson of her day. Wonder if
Elizabeth knew what Buffalo wings were.
http://www.saidwhat.co.uk/quotes/celebrity/jessica_simpson
Bill Barber wrote:
>
> Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An Incestuous
> Passion):
>
> * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she resembled
> her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large breasts...
>
> * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick woman,
> unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for this
> world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate with
> [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
>
> * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death of
> Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---began
> to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
>
> * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he, too,
> had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
>
> That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
>
>
>
>
Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 11:24:36
--- In , Bill Barber
<bbarber@...> wrote:
>
> Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
Incestuous
> Passion):
>
> * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
resembled
> her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
breasts...
>
> * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
woman,
> unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
this
> world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
with
> [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
>
> * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
of
> Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
began
> to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
>
> * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
too,
> had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
>
> That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
experts) brought a tape measure along.
Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
would remain?
What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
doesn't claim to be a historian.
<bbarber@...> wrote:
>
> Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
Incestuous
> Passion):
>
> * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
resembled
> her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
breasts...
>
> * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
woman,
> unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
this
> world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
with
> [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
>
> * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
of
> Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
began
> to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
>
> * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
too,
> had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
>
> That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
experts) brought a tape measure along.
Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
would remain?
What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
doesn't claim to be a historian.
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 12:38:13
The Portuguese ambassador is the source of Weir's preoccupation with
personal endowments.
Stephen Lark wrote:
>
> --- In
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Bill Barber
> <bbarber@...> wrote:
> >
> > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> Incestuous
> > Passion):
> >
> > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> resembled
> > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> breasts...
> >
> > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> woman,
> > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> this
> > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> with
> > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> >
> > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
> of
> > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> began
> > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> >
> > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
> too,
> > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> >
> > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> experts) brought a tape measure along.
> Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
> part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> would remain?
>
> What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
> doesn't claim to be a historian.
>
>
personal endowments.
Stephen Lark wrote:
>
> --- In
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Bill Barber
> <bbarber@...> wrote:
> >
> > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> Incestuous
> > Passion):
> >
> > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> resembled
> > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> breasts...
> >
> > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> woman,
> > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> this
> > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> with
> > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> >
> > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
> of
> > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> began
> > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> >
> > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
> too,
> > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> >
> > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> experts) brought a tape measure along.
> Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
> part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> would remain?
>
> What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
> doesn't claim to be a historian.
>
>
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 13:24:22
--- Bill Barber <bbarber@...> wrote:
> Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the
> Tower_ (An Incestuous
> Passion):
>
> * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In
> looks she resembled
> her mother, but her long red-gold hair was
> inherited from her
> Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she
> had large breasts...
>
> * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen
> Anne was a sick woman,
> unlikely to have any more children, and likely
> not long for this
> world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who
> better to mate with
> [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
>
> * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief
> [over the death of
> Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in
> need of comfort---began
> to look to his attractive, buxom niece for
> comfort.
>
> * Richard's attraction to his niece was not
> purely sensual: he, too,
> had perceived the enormous advantages in a
> union with her.
>
> That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
>
##Read altogether like this, her preoccupation comes
across as just weird.
Gilda
____________________________________________________________________________________
Never miss an email again!
Yahoo! Toolbar alerts you the instant new Mail arrives.
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> Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the
> Tower_ (An Incestuous
> Passion):
>
> * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In
> looks she resembled
> her mother, but her long red-gold hair was
> inherited from her
> Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she
> had large breasts...
>
> * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen
> Anne was a sick woman,
> unlikely to have any more children, and likely
> not long for this
> world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who
> better to mate with
> [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
>
> * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief
> [over the death of
> Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in
> need of comfort---began
> to look to his attractive, buxom niece for
> comfort.
>
> * Richard's attraction to his niece was not
> purely sensual: he, too,
> had perceived the enormous advantages in a
> union with her.
>
> That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
>
##Read altogether like this, her preoccupation comes
across as just weird.
Gilda
____________________________________________________________________________________
Never miss an email again!
Yahoo! Toolbar alerts you the instant new Mail arrives.
http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 14:14:28
Maybe she's jealous.
Gilda Felt wrote:
>
>
> --- Bill Barber <bbarber@eol. ca <mailto:bbarber%40eol.ca>> wrote:
>
> > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the
> > Tower_ (An Incestuous
> > Passion):
> >
> > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In
> > looks she resembled
> > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was
> > inherited from her
> > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she
> > had large breasts...
> >
> > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen
> > Anne was a sick woman,
> > unlikely to have any more children, and likely
> > not long for this
> > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who
> > better to mate with
> > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> >
> > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief
> > [over the death of
> > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in
> > need of comfort---began
> > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for
> > comfort.
> >
> > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not
> > purely sensual: he, too,
> > had perceived the enormous advantages in a
> > union with her.
> >
> > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> >
> ##Read altogether like this, her preoccupation comes
> across as just weird.
>
> Gilda
>
> ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
> Never miss an email again!
> Yahoo! Toolbar alerts you the instant new Mail arrives.
> http://tools. search.yahoo. com/toolbar/ features/ mail/
> <http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/>
>
>
Gilda Felt wrote:
>
>
> --- Bill Barber <bbarber@eol. ca <mailto:bbarber%40eol.ca>> wrote:
>
> > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the
> > Tower_ (An Incestuous
> > Passion):
> >
> > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In
> > looks she resembled
> > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was
> > inherited from her
> > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she
> > had large breasts...
> >
> > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen
> > Anne was a sick woman,
> > unlikely to have any more children, and likely
> > not long for this
> > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who
> > better to mate with
> > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> >
> > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief
> > [over the death of
> > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in
> > need of comfort---began
> > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for
> > comfort.
> >
> > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not
> > purely sensual: he, too,
> > had perceived the enormous advantages in a
> > union with her.
> >
> > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> >
> ##Read altogether like this, her preoccupation comes
> across as just weird.
>
> Gilda
>
> ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
> Never miss an email again!
> Yahoo! Toolbar alerts you the instant new Mail arrives.
> http://tools. search.yahoo. com/toolbar/ features/ mail/
> <http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/>
>
>
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 15:58:53
Or maybe the recently discovered poem
'Six foot three and 44D
Lizzy York's the gal for me'
(signed Dickon Rex, age 32 and a half)
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Barber
To:
Sent: Monday, March 12, 2007 12:34 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Weir's Prose
The Portuguese ambassador is the source of Weir's preoccupation with
personal endowments.
Stephen Lark wrote:
>
> --- In
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Bill Barber
> <bbarber@...> wrote:
> >
> > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> Incestuous
> > Passion):
> >
> > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> resembled
> > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> breasts...
> >
> > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> woman,
> > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> this
> > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> with
> > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> >
> > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
> of
> > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> began
> > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> >
> > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
> too,
> > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> >
> > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> experts) brought a tape measure along.
> Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
> part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> would remain?
>
> What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
> doesn't claim to be a historian.
>
>
'Six foot three and 44D
Lizzy York's the gal for me'
(signed Dickon Rex, age 32 and a half)
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Barber
To:
Sent: Monday, March 12, 2007 12:34 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Weir's Prose
The Portuguese ambassador is the source of Weir's preoccupation with
personal endowments.
Stephen Lark wrote:
>
> --- In
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Bill Barber
> <bbarber@...> wrote:
> >
> > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> Incestuous
> > Passion):
> >
> > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> resembled
> > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> breasts...
> >
> > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> woman,
> > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> this
> > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> with
> > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> >
> > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
> of
> > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> began
> > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> >
> > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
> too,
> > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> >
> > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> experts) brought a tape measure along.
> Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
> part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> would remain?
>
> What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
> doesn't claim to be a historian.
>
>
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 16:07:08
Well, there y'are. Is that one of Dunstable's poems?
Brian Wainwright wrote:
>
> Or maybe the recently discovered poem
>
> 'Six foot three and 44D
> Lizzy York's the gal for me'
> (signed Dickon Rex, age 32 and a half)
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Bill Barber
> To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, March 12, 2007 12:34 PM
> Subject: Re: Re: Weir's Prose
>
> The Portuguese ambassador is the source of Weir's preoccupation with
> personal endowments.
>
> Stephen Lark wrote:
> >
> > --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:richardiiis ocietyforum% 40yahoogroups. com>, Bill Barber
> > <bbarber@... > wrote:
> > >
> > > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> > Incestuous
> > > Passion):
> > >
> > > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> > resembled
> > > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> > breasts...
> > >
> > > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> > woman,
> > > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> > this
> > > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> > with
> > > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> > >
> > > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
> > of
> > > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> > began
> > > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> > >
> > > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
> > too,
> > > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> > >
> > > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> > Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> > disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> > experts) brought a tape measure along.
> > Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
> > part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> > would remain?
> >
> > What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
> > doesn't claim to be a historian.
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
Brian Wainwright wrote:
>
> Or maybe the recently discovered poem
>
> 'Six foot three and 44D
> Lizzy York's the gal for me'
> (signed Dickon Rex, age 32 and a half)
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Bill Barber
> To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, March 12, 2007 12:34 PM
> Subject: Re: Re: Weir's Prose
>
> The Portuguese ambassador is the source of Weir's preoccupation with
> personal endowments.
>
> Stephen Lark wrote:
> >
> > --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:richardiiis ocietyforum% 40yahoogroups. com>, Bill Barber
> > <bbarber@... > wrote:
> > >
> > > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> > Incestuous
> > > Passion):
> > >
> > > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> > resembled
> > > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> > breasts...
> > >
> > > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> > woman,
> > > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> > this
> > > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> > with
> > > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> > >
> > > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
> > of
> > > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> > began
> > > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> > >
> > > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
> > too,
> > > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> > >
> > > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> > Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> > disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> > experts) brought a tape measure along.
> > Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
> > part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> > would remain?
> >
> > What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
> > doesn't claim to be a historian.
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 16:21:33
Actually I believe that this came from the margin of Hastings' book of
hours. After Richard accidentally came across it, he had Hastings
foreshortened on the Tower green.
Brian Wainwright wrote:
>
> Or maybe the recently discovered poem
>
> 'Six foot three and 44D
> Lizzy York's the gal for me'
> (signed Dickon Rex, age 32 and a half)
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Bill Barber
> To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, March 12, 2007 12:34 PM
> Subject: Re: Re: Weir's Prose
>
> The Portuguese ambassador is the source of Weir's preoccupation with
> personal endowments.
>
> Stephen Lark wrote:
> >
> > --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:richardiiis ocietyforum% 40yahoogroups. com>, Bill Barber
> > <bbarber@... > wrote:
> > >
> > > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> > Incestuous
> > > Passion):
> > >
> > > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> > resembled
> > > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> > breasts...
> > >
> > > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> > woman,
> > > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> > this
> > > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> > with
> > > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> > >
> > > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
> > of
> > > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> > began
> > > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> > >
> > > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
> > too,
> > > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> > >
> > > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> > Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> > disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> > experts) brought a tape measure along.
> > Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
> > part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> > would remain?
> >
> > What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
> > doesn't claim to be a historian.
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
hours. After Richard accidentally came across it, he had Hastings
foreshortened on the Tower green.
Brian Wainwright wrote:
>
> Or maybe the recently discovered poem
>
> 'Six foot three and 44D
> Lizzy York's the gal for me'
> (signed Dickon Rex, age 32 and a half)
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Bill Barber
> To: richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, March 12, 2007 12:34 PM
> Subject: Re: Re: Weir's Prose
>
> The Portuguese ambassador is the source of Weir's preoccupation with
> personal endowments.
>
> Stephen Lark wrote:
> >
> > --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:richardiiis ocietyforum% 40yahoogroups. com>, Bill Barber
> > <bbarber@... > wrote:
> > >
> > > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> > Incestuous
> > > Passion):
> > >
> > > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> > resembled
> > > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> > breasts...
> > >
> > > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> > woman,
> > > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> > this
> > > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> > with
> > > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> > >
> > > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
> > of
> > > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> > began
> > > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> > >
> > > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
> > too,
> > > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> > >
> > > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> > Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> > disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> > experts) brought a tape measure along.
> > Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
> > part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> > would remain?
> >
> > What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
> > doesn't claim to be a historian.
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 16:45:16
There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth, but there was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece (and of the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the validity of Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
I'm not aware of ANY uncle-niece marriages among English royalty before or after 1485, nor any among the English nobility. Does anyone know of any?
The only contemporaneous example of a projected uncle-niece marriage I can think of was in 1464 when Enrique IV 'the Impotent' of Castile agreed that his 9-year-old half-brother, Alfonso, should be his heir, on the basis that he marry Enrique's putative daughter, Juana 'la Beltraneja'. If Juana really was Enrique's daughter rather than the offspring of his queen's adultery with Don Beltran de la Cueva, Duke of Alberquerque, then she and Alfonso were uncle and niece of the half-blood, but the marriage never took place and Alfonso died suddenly in 1468. Subsequently, of course, it was Isabella the Catholic who succeeded Enrique, and Juana was despatched to a convent.
For me, the fact that Richard and Elizabeth were uncle and niece makes the whole idea of a marriage between them unlikely in the extreme.
Ann
Stephen Lark <stephenmlark@...> wrote:
--- In , Bill Barber
<bbarber@...> wrote:
>
> Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
Incestuous
> Passion):
>
> * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
resembled
> her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
breasts...
>
> * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
woman,
> unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
this
> world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
with
> [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
>
> * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
of
> Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
began
> to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
>
> * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
too,
> had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
>
> That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
experts) brought a tape measure along.
Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
would remain?
What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
doesn't claim to be a historian.
I'm not aware of ANY uncle-niece marriages among English royalty before or after 1485, nor any among the English nobility. Does anyone know of any?
The only contemporaneous example of a projected uncle-niece marriage I can think of was in 1464 when Enrique IV 'the Impotent' of Castile agreed that his 9-year-old half-brother, Alfonso, should be his heir, on the basis that he marry Enrique's putative daughter, Juana 'la Beltraneja'. If Juana really was Enrique's daughter rather than the offspring of his queen's adultery with Don Beltran de la Cueva, Duke of Alberquerque, then she and Alfonso were uncle and niece of the half-blood, but the marriage never took place and Alfonso died suddenly in 1468. Subsequently, of course, it was Isabella the Catholic who succeeded Enrique, and Juana was despatched to a convent.
For me, the fact that Richard and Elizabeth were uncle and niece makes the whole idea of a marriage between them unlikely in the extreme.
Ann
Stephen Lark <stephenmlark@...> wrote:
--- In , Bill Barber
<bbarber@...> wrote:
>
> Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
Incestuous
> Passion):
>
> * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
resembled
> her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
breasts...
>
> * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
woman,
> unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
this
> world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
with
> [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
>
> * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
of
> Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
began
> to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
>
> * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
too,
> had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
>
> That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
experts) brought a tape measure along.
Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
would remain?
What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
doesn't claim to be a historian.
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 16:57:02
Agreed. I've decided to base a new career around Weiricisms. They're so
mind-expanding.
A LYON wrote:
>
> There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth, but there
> was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece (and of
> the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the validity of
> Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
>
> I'm not aware of ANY uncle-niece marriages among English royalty
> before or after 1485, nor any among the English nobility. Does anyone
> know of any?
>
> The only contemporaneous example of a projected uncle-niece marriage I
> can think of was in 1464 when Enrique IV 'the Impotent' of Castile
> agreed that his 9-year-old half-brother, Alfonso, should be his heir,
> on the basis that he marry Enrique's putative daughter, Juana 'la
> Beltraneja'. If Juana really was Enrique's daughter rather than the
> offspring of his queen's adultery with Don Beltran de la Cueva, Duke
> of Alberquerque, then she and Alfonso were uncle and niece of the
> half-blood, but the marriage never took place and Alfonso died
> suddenly in 1468. Subsequently, of course, it was Isabella the
> Catholic who succeeded Enrique, and Juana was despatched to a convent.
>
> For me, the fact that Richard and Elizabeth were uncle and niece makes
> the whole idea of a marriage between them unlikely in the extreme.
>
> Ann
>
> Stephen Lark <stephenmlark@...
> <mailto:stephenmlark%40talktalk.net>> wrote:
> --- In
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Bill Barber
> <bbarber@...> wrote:
> >
> > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> Incestuous
> > Passion):
> >
> > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> resembled
> > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> breasts...
> >
> > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> woman,
> > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> this
> > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> with
> > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> >
> > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
> of
> > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> began
> > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> >
> > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
> too,
> > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> >
> > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> experts) brought a tape measure along.
> Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
> part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> would remain?
>
> What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
> doesn't claim to be a historian.
>
>
>
>
mind-expanding.
A LYON wrote:
>
> There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth, but there
> was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece (and of
> the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the validity of
> Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
>
> I'm not aware of ANY uncle-niece marriages among English royalty
> before or after 1485, nor any among the English nobility. Does anyone
> know of any?
>
> The only contemporaneous example of a projected uncle-niece marriage I
> can think of was in 1464 when Enrique IV 'the Impotent' of Castile
> agreed that his 9-year-old half-brother, Alfonso, should be his heir,
> on the basis that he marry Enrique's putative daughter, Juana 'la
> Beltraneja'. If Juana really was Enrique's daughter rather than the
> offspring of his queen's adultery with Don Beltran de la Cueva, Duke
> of Alberquerque, then she and Alfonso were uncle and niece of the
> half-blood, but the marriage never took place and Alfonso died
> suddenly in 1468. Subsequently, of course, it was Isabella the
> Catholic who succeeded Enrique, and Juana was despatched to a convent.
>
> For me, the fact that Richard and Elizabeth were uncle and niece makes
> the whole idea of a marriage between them unlikely in the extreme.
>
> Ann
>
> Stephen Lark <stephenmlark@...
> <mailto:stephenmlark%40talktalk.net>> wrote:
> --- In
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Bill Barber
> <bbarber@...> wrote:
> >
> > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> Incestuous
> > Passion):
> >
> > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> resembled
> > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> breasts...
> >
> > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> woman,
> > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> this
> > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> with
> > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> >
> > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
> of
> > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> began
> > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> >
> > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
> too,
> > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> >
> > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> experts) brought a tape measure along.
> Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
> part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> would remain?
>
> What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
> doesn't claim to be a historian.
>
>
>
>
Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 17:00:09
--- In , "Stephen Lark"
<stephenmlark@...> wrote:
>
> --- In , Bill Barber
> <bbarber@> wrote:
> >
> > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> Incestuous
> > Passion):
> >
> > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> resembled
> > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from
her
> > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> breasts...
> >
> I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> experts) brought a tape measure along.
> Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring
that
> part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> would remain?
Come, now. It's a given of bodice-ripper historical fiction (which
is what Weir is actually writing) that the heroine is always a busty
redhead. Not that Eliz of York was a heroine.
Katy
<stephenmlark@...> wrote:
>
> --- In , Bill Barber
> <bbarber@> wrote:
> >
> > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> Incestuous
> > Passion):
> >
> > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> resembled
> > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from
her
> > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> breasts...
> >
> I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> experts) brought a tape measure along.
> Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring
that
> part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> would remain?
Come, now. It's a given of bodice-ripper historical fiction (which
is what Weir is actually writing) that the heroine is always a busty
redhead. Not that Eliz of York was a heroine.
Katy
[Richard III Society Forum] Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 21:34:43
--- In , Bill Barber <bbarber@...> wrote:
>
> Agreed. I've decided to base a new career around Weiricisms. They're so
> mind-expanding.
I am really please some forum members can see the funny side - I wish I could. When I
first read Bill's message about Elizabeth's big boobies, I really didnt know whether to laugh
or cry - eventually after some thought I just felt despair. Despair that historians such as
this bloody Weir woman are writing/selling/making money from such garbage still! And
still doing plenty of damage. For example I looked up her book The Princes in the Tower
(or whatever it is called) on Amazon. A woman has wriutten a review on it under the
heading 'An Old Mystery Solved' and goes on "her research clearly shows that despite all
those who have tried to exonerate him, Richard was the man responsible for the deaths of
his nephews" and "not only did he murder his two young nephews but he may have been
responsible for his wife's death as well. Certinaly he was already toying with the idea of
marrying his neice Elizabeth before his wife was finally dead" and finally describing it as an
"excellent' book" ends with "He did it - case closed".
Another thing they (on the Amazon site) have her down as being the co-author of the
book by Hicks Queen Anne Neville? Is that a mistake?
Eileen
>
> A LYON wrote:
> >
> > There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth, but there
> > was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece (and of
> > the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the validity of
> > Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
> >
> > I'm not aware of ANY uncle-niece marriages among English royalty
> > before or after 1485, nor any among the English nobility. Does anyone
> > know of any?
> >
> > The only contemporaneous example of a projected uncle-niece marriage I
> > can think of was in 1464 when Enrique IV 'the Impotent' of Castile
> > agreed that his 9-year-old half-brother, Alfonso, should be his heir,
> > on the basis that he marry Enrique's putative daughter, Juana 'la
> > Beltraneja'. If Juana really was Enrique's daughter rather than the
> > offspring of his queen's adultery with Don Beltran de la Cueva, Duke
> > of Alberquerque, then she and Alfonso were uncle and niece of the
> > half-blood, but the marriage never took place and Alfonso died
> > suddenly in 1468. Subsequently, of course, it was Isabella the
> > Catholic who succeeded Enrique, and Juana was despatched to a convent.
> >
> > For me, the fact that Richard and Elizabeth were uncle and niece makes
> > the whole idea of a marriage between them unlikely in the extreme.
> >
> > Ann
> >
> > Stephen Lark <stephenmlark@...
> > <mailto:stephenmlark%40talktalk.net>> wrote:
> > --- In
> > <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Bill Barber
> > <bbarber@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> > Incestuous
> > > Passion):
> > >
> > > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> > resembled
> > > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> > breasts...
> > >
> > > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> > woman,
> > > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> > this
> > > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> > with
> > > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> > >
> > > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
> > of
> > > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> > began
> > > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> > >
> > > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
> > too,
> > > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> > >
> > > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> > Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> > disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> > experts) brought a tape measure along.
> > Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
> > part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> > would remain?
> >
> > What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
> > doesn't claim to be a historian.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Agreed. I've decided to base a new career around Weiricisms. They're so
> mind-expanding.
I am really please some forum members can see the funny side - I wish I could. When I
first read Bill's message about Elizabeth's big boobies, I really didnt know whether to laugh
or cry - eventually after some thought I just felt despair. Despair that historians such as
this bloody Weir woman are writing/selling/making money from such garbage still! And
still doing plenty of damage. For example I looked up her book The Princes in the Tower
(or whatever it is called) on Amazon. A woman has wriutten a review on it under the
heading 'An Old Mystery Solved' and goes on "her research clearly shows that despite all
those who have tried to exonerate him, Richard was the man responsible for the deaths of
his nephews" and "not only did he murder his two young nephews but he may have been
responsible for his wife's death as well. Certinaly he was already toying with the idea of
marrying his neice Elizabeth before his wife was finally dead" and finally describing it as an
"excellent' book" ends with "He did it - case closed".
Another thing they (on the Amazon site) have her down as being the co-author of the
book by Hicks Queen Anne Neville? Is that a mistake?
Eileen
>
> A LYON wrote:
> >
> > There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth, but there
> > was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece (and of
> > the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the validity of
> > Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
> >
> > I'm not aware of ANY uncle-niece marriages among English royalty
> > before or after 1485, nor any among the English nobility. Does anyone
> > know of any?
> >
> > The only contemporaneous example of a projected uncle-niece marriage I
> > can think of was in 1464 when Enrique IV 'the Impotent' of Castile
> > agreed that his 9-year-old half-brother, Alfonso, should be his heir,
> > on the basis that he marry Enrique's putative daughter, Juana 'la
> > Beltraneja'. If Juana really was Enrique's daughter rather than the
> > offspring of his queen's adultery with Don Beltran de la Cueva, Duke
> > of Alberquerque, then she and Alfonso were uncle and niece of the
> > half-blood, but the marriage never took place and Alfonso died
> > suddenly in 1468. Subsequently, of course, it was Isabella the
> > Catholic who succeeded Enrique, and Juana was despatched to a convent.
> >
> > For me, the fact that Richard and Elizabeth were uncle and niece makes
> > the whole idea of a marriage between them unlikely in the extreme.
> >
> > Ann
> >
> > Stephen Lark <stephenmlark@...
> > <mailto:stephenmlark%40talktalk.net>> wrote:
> > --- In
> > <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Bill Barber
> > <bbarber@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> > Incestuous
> > > Passion):
> > >
> > > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> > resembled
> > > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> > breasts...
> > >
> > > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> > woman,
> > > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> > this
> > > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> > with
> > > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> > >
> > > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
> > of
> > > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> > began
> > > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> > >
> > > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
> > too,
> > > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> > >
> > > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> > Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> > disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> > experts) brought a tape measure along.
> > Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
> > part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> > would remain?
> >
> > What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
> > doesn't claim to be a historian.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 21:47:40
I know what you mean. When something strikes me as both sad and silly, I
tend to go for the gallows humour...literally.
eileen wrote:
>
> --- In
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Bill Barber
> <bbarber@...> wrote:
> >
> > Agreed. I've decided to base a new career around Weiricisms. They're so
> > mind-expanding.
>
> I am really please some forum members can see the funny side - I wish
> I could. When I
> first read Bill's message about Elizabeth's big boobies, I really
> didnt know whether to laugh
> or cry - eventually after some thought I just felt despair. Despair
> that historians such as
> this bloody Weir woman are writing/selling/making money from such
> garbage still! And
> still doing plenty of damage. For example I looked up her book The
> Princes in the Tower
> (or whatever it is called) on Amazon. A woman has wriutten a review on
> it under the
> heading 'An Old Mystery Solved' and goes on "her research clearly
> shows that despite all
> those who have tried to exonerate him, Richard was the man responsible
> for the deaths of
> his nephews" and "not only did he murder his two young nephews but he
> may have been
> responsible for his wife's death as well. Certinaly he was already
> toying with the idea of
> marrying his neice Elizabeth before his wife was finally dead" and
> finally describing it as an
> "excellent' book" ends with "He did it - case closed".
>
> Another thing they (on the Amazon site) have her down as being the
> co-author of the
> book by Hicks Queen Anne Neville? Is that a mistake?
>
> Eileen
> >
> > A LYON wrote:
> > >
> > > There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth, but
> there
> > > was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece (and of
> > > the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the validity of
> > > Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
> > >
> > > I'm not aware of ANY uncle-niece marriages among English royalty
> > > before or after 1485, nor any among the English nobility. Does anyone
> > > know of any?
> > >
> > > The only contemporaneous example of a projected uncle-niece
> marriage I
> > > can think of was in 1464 when Enrique IV 'the Impotent' of Castile
> > > agreed that his 9-year-old half-brother, Alfonso, should be his heir,
> > > on the basis that he marry Enrique's putative daughter, Juana 'la
> > > Beltraneja'. If Juana really was Enrique's daughter rather than the
> > > offspring of his queen's adultery with Don Beltran de la Cueva, Duke
> > > of Alberquerque, then she and Alfonso were uncle and niece of the
> > > half-blood, but the marriage never took place and Alfonso died
> > > suddenly in 1468. Subsequently, of course, it was Isabella the
> > > Catholic who succeeded Enrique, and Juana was despatched to a convent.
> > >
> > > For me, the fact that Richard and Elizabeth were uncle and niece
> makes
> > > the whole idea of a marriage between them unlikely in the extreme.
> > >
> > > Ann
> > >
> > > Stephen Lark <stephenmlark@...
> > > <mailto:stephenmlark%40talktalk.net>> wrote:
> > > --- In
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Bill Barber
> > > <bbarber@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> > > Incestuous
> > > > Passion):
> > > >
> > > > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> > > resembled
> > > > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > > > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> > > breasts...
> > > >
> > > > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> > > woman,
> > > > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> > > this
> > > > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> > > with
> > > > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> > > >
> > > > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
> > > of
> > > > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> > > began
> > > > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> > > >
> > > > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
> > > too,
> > > > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> > > >
> > > > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> > > Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> > > disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> > > experts) brought a tape measure along.
> > > Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
> > > part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> > > would remain?
> > >
> > > What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
> > > doesn't claim to be a historian.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
tend to go for the gallows humour...literally.
eileen wrote:
>
> --- In
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Bill Barber
> <bbarber@...> wrote:
> >
> > Agreed. I've decided to base a new career around Weiricisms. They're so
> > mind-expanding.
>
> I am really please some forum members can see the funny side - I wish
> I could. When I
> first read Bill's message about Elizabeth's big boobies, I really
> didnt know whether to laugh
> or cry - eventually after some thought I just felt despair. Despair
> that historians such as
> this bloody Weir woman are writing/selling/making money from such
> garbage still! And
> still doing plenty of damage. For example I looked up her book The
> Princes in the Tower
> (or whatever it is called) on Amazon. A woman has wriutten a review on
> it under the
> heading 'An Old Mystery Solved' and goes on "her research clearly
> shows that despite all
> those who have tried to exonerate him, Richard was the man responsible
> for the deaths of
> his nephews" and "not only did he murder his two young nephews but he
> may have been
> responsible for his wife's death as well. Certinaly he was already
> toying with the idea of
> marrying his neice Elizabeth before his wife was finally dead" and
> finally describing it as an
> "excellent' book" ends with "He did it - case closed".
>
> Another thing they (on the Amazon site) have her down as being the
> co-author of the
> book by Hicks Queen Anne Neville? Is that a mistake?
>
> Eileen
> >
> > A LYON wrote:
> > >
> > > There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth, but
> there
> > > was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece (and of
> > > the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the validity of
> > > Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
> > >
> > > I'm not aware of ANY uncle-niece marriages among English royalty
> > > before or after 1485, nor any among the English nobility. Does anyone
> > > know of any?
> > >
> > > The only contemporaneous example of a projected uncle-niece
> marriage I
> > > can think of was in 1464 when Enrique IV 'the Impotent' of Castile
> > > agreed that his 9-year-old half-brother, Alfonso, should be his heir,
> > > on the basis that he marry Enrique's putative daughter, Juana 'la
> > > Beltraneja'. If Juana really was Enrique's daughter rather than the
> > > offspring of his queen's adultery with Don Beltran de la Cueva, Duke
> > > of Alberquerque, then she and Alfonso were uncle and niece of the
> > > half-blood, but the marriage never took place and Alfonso died
> > > suddenly in 1468. Subsequently, of course, it was Isabella the
> > > Catholic who succeeded Enrique, and Juana was despatched to a convent.
> > >
> > > For me, the fact that Richard and Elizabeth were uncle and niece
> makes
> > > the whole idea of a marriage between them unlikely in the extreme.
> > >
> > > Ann
> > >
> > > Stephen Lark <stephenmlark@...
> > > <mailto:stephenmlark%40talktalk.net>> wrote:
> > > --- In
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Bill Barber
> > > <bbarber@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> > > Incestuous
> > > > Passion):
> > > >
> > > > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> > > resembled
> > > > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > > > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> > > breasts...
> > > >
> > > > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> > > woman,
> > > > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> > > this
> > > > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> > > with
> > > > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> > > >
> > > > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the death
> > > of
> > > > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> > > began
> > > > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> > > >
> > > > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual: he,
> > > too,
> > > > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> > > >
> > > > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> > > Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse secretly
> > > disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> > > experts) brought a tape measure along.
> > > Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring that
> > > part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> > > would remain?
> > >
> > > What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The latter
> > > doesn't claim to be a historian.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
[Richard III Society Forum] Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 21:56:59
I have read several reviews on Amazon by this lady you were referring
to. As she admits herself, she was once a firm believer in Richard's
innocence but now has switched her allegiance completely. Isn't that
the case with a lot of the most virulent Richard haters? Seward
springs to mind and I think even Weir herself admitted to being
seduced by "The Daughter of Time". What went wrong?? I hope that
isn't the fate waiting for us all??
--- In , "eileen"
<ebatesparrot@...> wrote:
>
> --- In , Bill Barber
<bbarber@> wrote:
> >
> > Agreed. I've decided to base a new career around Weiricisms.
They're so
> > mind-expanding.
>
> I am really please some forum members can see the funny side - I
wish I could. When I
> first read Bill's message about Elizabeth's big boobies, I really
didnt know whether to laugh
> or cry - eventually after some thought I just felt despair.
Despair that historians such as
> this bloody Weir woman are writing/selling/making money from such
garbage still! And
> still doing plenty of damage. For example I looked up her book The
Princes in the Tower
> (or whatever it is called) on Amazon. A woman has wriutten a
review on it under the
> heading 'An Old Mystery Solved' and goes on "her research clearly
shows that despite all
> those who have tried to exonerate him, Richard was the man
responsible for the deaths of
> his nephews" and "not only did he murder his two young nephews but
he may have been
> responsible for his wife's death as well. Certinaly he was already
toying with the idea of
> marrying his neice Elizabeth before his wife was finally dead" and
finally describing it as an
> "excellent' book" ends with "He did it - case closed".
>
> Another thing they (on the Amazon site) have her down as being the
co-author of the
> book by Hicks Queen Anne Neville? Is that a mistake?
>
> Eileen
> >
> > A LYON wrote:
> > >
> > > There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth,
but there
> > > was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece
(and of
> > > the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the
validity of
> > > Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
> > >
> > > I'm not aware of ANY uncle-niece marriages among English
royalty
> > > before or after 1485, nor any among the English nobility. Does
anyone
> > > know of any?
> > >
> > > The only contemporaneous example of a projected uncle-niece
marriage I
> > > can think of was in 1464 when Enrique IV 'the Impotent' of
Castile
> > > agreed that his 9-year-old half-brother, Alfonso, should be his
heir,
> > > on the basis that he marry Enrique's putative daughter,
Juana 'la
> > > Beltraneja'. If Juana really was Enrique's daughter rather than
the
> > > offspring of his queen's adultery with Don Beltran de la Cueva,
Duke
> > > of Alberquerque, then she and Alfonso were uncle and niece of
the
> > > half-blood, but the marriage never took place and Alfonso died
> > > suddenly in 1468. Subsequently, of course, it was Isabella the
> > > Catholic who succeeded Enrique, and Juana was despatched to a
convent.
> > >
> > > For me, the fact that Richard and Elizabeth were uncle and
niece makes
> > > the whole idea of a marriage between them unlikely in the
extreme.
> > >
> > > Ann
> > >
> > > Stephen Lark <stephenmlark@
> > > <mailto:stephenmlark%40talktalk.net>> wrote:
> > > --- In
> > > <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Bill Barber
> > > <bbarber@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> > > Incestuous
> > > > Passion):
> > > >
> > > > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> > > resembled
> > > > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > > > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> > > breasts...
> > > >
> > > > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> > > woman,
> > > > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> > > this
> > > > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> > > with
> > > > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> > > >
> > > > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the
death
> > > of
> > > > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> > > began
> > > > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> > > >
> > > > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual:
he,
> > > too,
> > > > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> > > >
> > > > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> > > Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse
secretly
> > > disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> > > experts) brought a tape measure along.
> > > Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring
that
> > > part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> > > would remain?
> > >
> > > What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The
latter
> > > doesn't claim to be a historian.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
to. As she admits herself, she was once a firm believer in Richard's
innocence but now has switched her allegiance completely. Isn't that
the case with a lot of the most virulent Richard haters? Seward
springs to mind and I think even Weir herself admitted to being
seduced by "The Daughter of Time". What went wrong?? I hope that
isn't the fate waiting for us all??
--- In , "eileen"
<ebatesparrot@...> wrote:
>
> --- In , Bill Barber
<bbarber@> wrote:
> >
> > Agreed. I've decided to base a new career around Weiricisms.
They're so
> > mind-expanding.
>
> I am really please some forum members can see the funny side - I
wish I could. When I
> first read Bill's message about Elizabeth's big boobies, I really
didnt know whether to laugh
> or cry - eventually after some thought I just felt despair.
Despair that historians such as
> this bloody Weir woman are writing/selling/making money from such
garbage still! And
> still doing plenty of damage. For example I looked up her book The
Princes in the Tower
> (or whatever it is called) on Amazon. A woman has wriutten a
review on it under the
> heading 'An Old Mystery Solved' and goes on "her research clearly
shows that despite all
> those who have tried to exonerate him, Richard was the man
responsible for the deaths of
> his nephews" and "not only did he murder his two young nephews but
he may have been
> responsible for his wife's death as well. Certinaly he was already
toying with the idea of
> marrying his neice Elizabeth before his wife was finally dead" and
finally describing it as an
> "excellent' book" ends with "He did it - case closed".
>
> Another thing they (on the Amazon site) have her down as being the
co-author of the
> book by Hicks Queen Anne Neville? Is that a mistake?
>
> Eileen
> >
> > A LYON wrote:
> > >
> > > There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth,
but there
> > > was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece
(and of
> > > the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the
validity of
> > > Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
> > >
> > > I'm not aware of ANY uncle-niece marriages among English
royalty
> > > before or after 1485, nor any among the English nobility. Does
anyone
> > > know of any?
> > >
> > > The only contemporaneous example of a projected uncle-niece
marriage I
> > > can think of was in 1464 when Enrique IV 'the Impotent' of
Castile
> > > agreed that his 9-year-old half-brother, Alfonso, should be his
heir,
> > > on the basis that he marry Enrique's putative daughter,
Juana 'la
> > > Beltraneja'. If Juana really was Enrique's daughter rather than
the
> > > offspring of his queen's adultery with Don Beltran de la Cueva,
Duke
> > > of Alberquerque, then she and Alfonso were uncle and niece of
the
> > > half-blood, but the marriage never took place and Alfonso died
> > > suddenly in 1468. Subsequently, of course, it was Isabella the
> > > Catholic who succeeded Enrique, and Juana was despatched to a
convent.
> > >
> > > For me, the fact that Richard and Elizabeth were uncle and
niece makes
> > > the whole idea of a marriage between them unlikely in the
extreme.
> > >
> > > Ann
> > >
> > > Stephen Lark <stephenmlark@
> > > <mailto:stephenmlark%40talktalk.net>> wrote:
> > > --- In
> > > <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Bill Barber
> > > <bbarber@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Here are some excerpts from _The Princes in the Tower_ (An
> > > Incestuous
> > > > Passion):
> > > >
> > > > * In 1484, Elizabeth of York was eighteen. In looks she
> > > resembled
> > > > her mother, but her long red-gold hair was inherited from her
> > > > Plantagenet forbears. Of medium height, she had large
> > > breasts...
> > > >
> > > > * By the end of 1484, it was clear that Queen Anne was a sick
> > > woman,
> > > > unlikely to have any more children, and likely not long for
> > > this
> > > > world...if Anne died, as seemed likely..who better to mate
> > > with
> > > > [Richard] than the Lady Elizabeth?
> > > >
> > > > * With Anne ill, and preoccupied with her grief [over the
death
> > > of
> > > > Edward of Middleham], Richard---himself in need of comfort---
> > > began
> > > > to look to his attractive, buxom niece for comfort.
> > > >
> > > > * Richard's attraction to his niece was not purely sensual:
he,
> > > too,
> > > > had perceived the enormous advantages in a union with her.
> > > >
> > > > That's all for tonight. Sleep tight, children.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > I don't want to be indelicate but how on earth could Weir know
> > > Elizabeth of York's bust size? Perhaps she had the corpse
secretly
> > > disinterred and an expert from Rigby & Peller (royal lingerie
> > > experts) brought a tape measure along.
> > > Just to take that point seriously for a moment, would measuring
that
> > > part of the skeleton reveal the size - after all, only the bones
> > > would remain?
> > >
> > > What is the difference between Weir and Georgette Heyer? The
latter
> > > doesn't claim to be a historian.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 22:46:42
For some reason this makes me think of Monty Python's one fairy
tale where the Princess Mitzi Gaynor had fabulous tits and wooden
teeth that she varnished every day and took her dead dog for a drag
around the yard because nobody had the heart to tell her about
unpleasant things like death or in "Monty Python and the Holy Grail"
where the princess had "huge tracks of land" and was supposed to
marry the heir of Swamp Castle----just tinker with the dialogue and:
Henry Tudor: But I don't love her Mother.
Margaret Beaufort: Waddya mean ya don't love her! What's not to
like about her----she's got HUGE tracks of land!(holds cupped hands
way out in front of chest)
And now for something completely different . . .
"Meek"
> I guess we could sum up Elizabeth of York as a woman with big boobs
and
> enormous advantages: sort of the Jessica Simpson of her day. Wonder
if
> Elizabeth knew what Buffalo wings were.
> http://www.saidwhat.co.uk/quotes/celebrity/jessica_simpson
>
> Bill Barber wrote:
tale where the Princess Mitzi Gaynor had fabulous tits and wooden
teeth that she varnished every day and took her dead dog for a drag
around the yard because nobody had the heart to tell her about
unpleasant things like death or in "Monty Python and the Holy Grail"
where the princess had "huge tracks of land" and was supposed to
marry the heir of Swamp Castle----just tinker with the dialogue and:
Henry Tudor: But I don't love her Mother.
Margaret Beaufort: Waddya mean ya don't love her! What's not to
like about her----she's got HUGE tracks of land!(holds cupped hands
way out in front of chest)
And now for something completely different . . .
"Meek"
> I guess we could sum up Elizabeth of York as a woman with big boobs
and
> enormous advantages: sort of the Jessica Simpson of her day. Wonder
if
> Elizabeth knew what Buffalo wings were.
> http://www.saidwhat.co.uk/quotes/celebrity/jessica_simpson
>
> Bill Barber wrote:
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 22:52:05
--- amertzanis <amertzanis@...> wrote:
>
> I have read several reviews on Amazon by this lady
> you were referring
> to. As she admits herself, she was once a firm
> believer in Richard's
> innocence but now has switched her allegiance
> completely. Isn't that
> the case with a lot of the most virulent Richard
> haters? Seward
> springs to mind and I think even Weir herself
> admitted to being
> seduced by "The Daughter of Time". What went
> wrong?? I hope that
> isn't the fate waiting for us all??
**Good lord, I hope not!! But seriously, I wonder if
those who do that are people who are unable to see the
gray of things. Everything is black and white in their
world. They either worship Richard or they despise
him. So when they discover "evidence" that they think
proves his guilt they take it as a personal affront
because it's all his fault for letting them down. I
admire the man, yes. But worship? No.
Gilda
____________________________________________________________________________________
Get your own web address.
Have a HUGE year through Yahoo! Small Business.
http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/domains/?p=BESTDEAL
>
> I have read several reviews on Amazon by this lady
> you were referring
> to. As she admits herself, she was once a firm
> believer in Richard's
> innocence but now has switched her allegiance
> completely. Isn't that
> the case with a lot of the most virulent Richard
> haters? Seward
> springs to mind and I think even Weir herself
> admitted to being
> seduced by "The Daughter of Time". What went
> wrong?? I hope that
> isn't the fate waiting for us all??
**Good lord, I hope not!! But seriously, I wonder if
those who do that are people who are unable to see the
gray of things. Everything is black and white in their
world. They either worship Richard or they despise
him. So when they discover "evidence" that they think
proves his guilt they take it as a personal affront
because it's all his fault for letting them down. I
admire the man, yes. But worship? No.
Gilda
____________________________________________________________________________________
Get your own web address.
Have a HUGE year through Yahoo! Small Business.
http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/domains/?p=BESTDEAL
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 23:01:01
--- In , "L. Miller" <pvtmeek@...> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Henry Tudor: But I don't love her Mother.
>
> Margaret Beaufort: Waddya mean ya don't love her! What's not to
> like about her----she's got HUGE tracks of land!(holds cupped hands
> way out in front of chest)
>
> And now for something completely different . . .
>
> "Meek"
OK OK now you have made me laugh!! :0 )
Eileen
>
>
>
> > I guess we could sum up Elizabeth of York as a woman with big boobs
> and
> > enormous advantages: sort of the Jessica Simpson of her day. Wonder
> if
> > Elizabeth knew what Buffalo wings were.
> > http://www.saidwhat.co.uk/quotes/celebrity/jessica_simpson
> >
> > Bill Barber wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> Henry Tudor: But I don't love her Mother.
>
> Margaret Beaufort: Waddya mean ya don't love her! What's not to
> like about her----she's got HUGE tracks of land!(holds cupped hands
> way out in front of chest)
>
> And now for something completely different . . .
>
> "Meek"
OK OK now you have made me laugh!! :0 )
Eileen
>
>
>
> > I guess we could sum up Elizabeth of York as a woman with big boobs
> and
> > enormous advantages: sort of the Jessica Simpson of her day. Wonder
> if
> > Elizabeth knew what Buffalo wings were.
> > http://www.saidwhat.co.uk/quotes/celebrity/jessica_simpson
> >
> > Bill Barber wrote:
>
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 23:02:48
I absolutely agree. Some are almost cultish in their adoration. He was
very much a man of his time.
Gilda Felt wrote:
>
>
> --- amertzanis <amertzanis@...
> <mailto:amertzanis%40yahoo.co.uk>> wrote:
>
> >
> > I have read several reviews on Amazon by this lady
> > you were referring
> > to. As she admits herself, she was once a firm
> > believer in Richard's
> > innocence but now has switched her allegiance
> > completely. Isn't that
> > the case with a lot of the most virulent Richard
> > haters? Seward
> > springs to mind and I think even Weir herself
> > admitted to being
> > seduced by "The Daughter of Time". What went
> > wrong?? I hope that
> > isn't the fate waiting for us all??
>
> **Good lord, I hope not!! But seriously, I wonder if
> those who do that are people who are unable to see the
> gray of things. Everything is black and white in their
> world. They either worship Richard or they despise
> him. So when they discover "evidence" that they think
> proves his guilt they take it as a personal affront
> because it's all his fault for letting them down. I
> admire the man, yes. But worship? No.
>
> Gilda
>
> __________________________________________________________
> Get your own web address.
> Have a HUGE year through Yahoo! Small Business.
> http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/domains/?p=BESTDEAL
> <http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/domains/?p=BESTDEAL>
>
>
very much a man of his time.
Gilda Felt wrote:
>
>
> --- amertzanis <amertzanis@...
> <mailto:amertzanis%40yahoo.co.uk>> wrote:
>
> >
> > I have read several reviews on Amazon by this lady
> > you were referring
> > to. As she admits herself, she was once a firm
> > believer in Richard's
> > innocence but now has switched her allegiance
> > completely. Isn't that
> > the case with a lot of the most virulent Richard
> > haters? Seward
> > springs to mind and I think even Weir herself
> > admitted to being
> > seduced by "The Daughter of Time". What went
> > wrong?? I hope that
> > isn't the fate waiting for us all??
>
> **Good lord, I hope not!! But seriously, I wonder if
> those who do that are people who are unable to see the
> gray of things. Everything is black and white in their
> world. They either worship Richard or they despise
> him. So when they discover "evidence" that they think
> proves his guilt they take it as a personal affront
> because it's all his fault for letting them down. I
> admire the man, yes. But worship? No.
>
> Gilda
>
> __________________________________________________________
> Get your own web address.
> Have a HUGE year through Yahoo! Small Business.
> http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/domains/?p=BESTDEAL
> <http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/domains/?p=BESTDEAL>
>
>
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 23:26:31
It has been great fun reading all the Weir posts --
Elizabeth of York must be shuddering in horror (or
laughing?) in her grave knowing the size of her
breasts are being discussed hundreds of years in the
future ;-). And I agree, how on earth could Weir
possibly know this information??? Do her official
portraits show her to be um, overly endowed?
In Sunday's Atlanta Journal/Constitution, there was a
gag inducing article on Weir's "Debut into historical
fiction" !!!! The writer said that she had was a well
respected historian (ha), who had written several
non-fiction books about British royals, and that her
new book was a great read, even better than Phillipa
Gregory's historical novels. Since I like Phillipa
Gregory's novels, I might overcome my better judgement
and read this tome for myself. ;-)
Rene'
Elizabeth of York must be shuddering in horror (or
laughing?) in her grave knowing the size of her
breasts are being discussed hundreds of years in the
future ;-). And I agree, how on earth could Weir
possibly know this information??? Do her official
portraits show her to be um, overly endowed?
In Sunday's Atlanta Journal/Constitution, there was a
gag inducing article on Weir's "Debut into historical
fiction" !!!! The writer said that she had was a well
respected historian (ha), who had written several
non-fiction books about British royals, and that her
new book was a great read, even better than Phillipa
Gregory's historical novels. Since I like Phillipa
Gregory's novels, I might overcome my better judgement
and read this tome for myself. ;-)
Rene'
[Richard III Society Forum] Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-12 23:36:36
--- In , Bill Barber <bbarber@...> wrote:
>
> I absolutely agree. Some are almost cultish in their adoration. He was
> very much a man of his time.
Oh Bill - I fear I am a little like that! Guilty, guilty, guilty. I have felt that way for 20 odd
years - Daughter of Time got my interest - I do, its true, get annoyed when I hear anything
anti-Richard!! Well I just see a King, yes a man of his time, but who tried to do so much
good. Basically put in the most diabolical of positions when his brother died too early -
stuck between a hard place and a rock. When I read some things he wrote in his own
hand, for example gently trying to pursuade Thomas Lynom out of marriage to Jane Shore
but adding 'if he be utter set to marry her we are content' - his postscript regardding
Buckinghams treason, a man totally in shock calling Buckingham 'the most untrue creature
living' and the City of York's 'great heaviness' on the news of his death. When I hear
someone diss him well I just want to punch their lights out!! Can't change my stance now
Im afraid - too old : 0)
Eileen
>
> Gilda Felt wrote:
> >
> >
> > --- amertzanis <amertzanis@...
> > <mailto:amertzanis%40yahoo.co.uk>> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > I have read several reviews on Amazon by this lady
> > > you were referring
> > > to. As she admits herself, she was once a firm
> > > believer in Richard's
> > > innocence but now has switched her allegiance
> > > completely. Isn't that
> > > the case with a lot of the most virulent Richard
> > > haters? Seward
> > > springs to mind and I think even Weir herself
> > > admitted to being
> > > seduced by "The Daughter of Time". What went
> > > wrong?? I hope that
> > > isn't the fate waiting for us all??
> >
> > **Good lord, I hope not!! But seriously, I wonder if
> > those who do that are people who are unable to see the
> > gray of things. Everything is black and white in their
> > world. They either worship Richard or they despise
> > him. So when they discover "evidence" that they think
> > proves his guilt they take it as a personal affront
> > because it's all his fault for letting them down. I
> > admire the man, yes. But worship? No.
> >
> > Gilda
> >
> > __________________________________________________________
> > Get your own web address.
> > Have a HUGE year through Yahoo! Small Business.
> > http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/domains/?p=BESTDEAL
> > <http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/domains/?p=BESTDEAL>
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I absolutely agree. Some are almost cultish in their adoration. He was
> very much a man of his time.
Oh Bill - I fear I am a little like that! Guilty, guilty, guilty. I have felt that way for 20 odd
years - Daughter of Time got my interest - I do, its true, get annoyed when I hear anything
anti-Richard!! Well I just see a King, yes a man of his time, but who tried to do so much
good. Basically put in the most diabolical of positions when his brother died too early -
stuck between a hard place and a rock. When I read some things he wrote in his own
hand, for example gently trying to pursuade Thomas Lynom out of marriage to Jane Shore
but adding 'if he be utter set to marry her we are content' - his postscript regardding
Buckinghams treason, a man totally in shock calling Buckingham 'the most untrue creature
living' and the City of York's 'great heaviness' on the news of his death. When I hear
someone diss him well I just want to punch their lights out!! Can't change my stance now
Im afraid - too old : 0)
Eileen
>
> Gilda Felt wrote:
> >
> >
> > --- amertzanis <amertzanis@...
> > <mailto:amertzanis%40yahoo.co.uk>> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > I have read several reviews on Amazon by this lady
> > > you were referring
> > > to. As she admits herself, she was once a firm
> > > believer in Richard's
> > > innocence but now has switched her allegiance
> > > completely. Isn't that
> > > the case with a lot of the most virulent Richard
> > > haters? Seward
> > > springs to mind and I think even Weir herself
> > > admitted to being
> > > seduced by "The Daughter of Time". What went
> > > wrong?? I hope that
> > > isn't the fate waiting for us all??
> >
> > **Good lord, I hope not!! But seriously, I wonder if
> > those who do that are people who are unable to see the
> > gray of things. Everything is black and white in their
> > world. They either worship Richard or they despise
> > him. So when they discover "evidence" that they think
> > proves his guilt they take it as a personal affront
> > because it's all his fault for letting them down. I
> > admire the man, yes. But worship? No.
> >
> > Gilda
> >
> > __________________________________________________________
> > Get your own web address.
> > Have a HUGE year through Yahoo! Small Business.
> > http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/domains/?p=BESTDEAL
> > <http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/domains/?p=BESTDEAL>
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
[Richard III Society Forum] Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-13 00:33:23
If Helen of Troy had a face that launched a thousand ships then
Elizabeth of York had the hooters for Tudor?
"Meek"(more naughty bits)
> Or maybe the recently discovered poem
>
> 'Six foot three and 44D
> Lizzy York's the gal for me'
> (signed Dickon Rex, age 32 and a half)
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Bill Barber
> To:
> Sent: Monday, March 12, 2007 12:34 PM
> Subject: Re: Re: Weir's Prose
>
>
> The Portuguese ambassador is the source of Weir's preoccupation
with
> personal endowments.
>
>>
Elizabeth of York had the hooters for Tudor?
"Meek"(more naughty bits)
> Or maybe the recently discovered poem
>
> 'Six foot three and 44D
> Lizzy York's the gal for me'
> (signed Dickon Rex, age 32 and a half)
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Bill Barber
> To:
> Sent: Monday, March 12, 2007 12:34 PM
> Subject: Re: Re: Weir's Prose
>
>
> The Portuguese ambassador is the source of Weir's preoccupation
with
> personal endowments.
>
>>
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Re: Weir's Prose
2007-03-13 04:49:14
Georgette Heyer stayed true to history even though she wrote fiction. She did research on whoever she was writing about and made sure that is what she wrote about. Now her fictional characters that was a different story. Dee
klingonwitch@...
YAHOO/AIM/AOL dragonscub1a ICQ 380495169
WINDOWS LIVE/MSN drgnscub1@...
Save the earth. It's the only planet with chocolate.
"Thou shall not meddle in the affairs of dragons, thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."
Argue not with dragons, for thou art crunchy and go well with brie "Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus"
---------------------------------
Now that's room service! Choose from over 150,000 hotels
in 45,000 destinations on Yahoo! Travel to find your fit.
klingonwitch@...
YAHOO/AIM/AOL dragonscub1a ICQ 380495169
WINDOWS LIVE/MSN drgnscub1@...
Save the earth. It's the only planet with chocolate.
"Thou shall not meddle in the affairs of dragons, thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."
Argue not with dragons, for thou art crunchy and go well with brie "Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus"
---------------------------------
Now that's room service! Choose from over 150,000 hotels
in 45,000 destinations on Yahoo! Travel to find your fit.
[Richard III Society Forum] Re: Richard & Elizabeth (Weir's Prose)
2007-03-13 14:34:15
They were only of the whole blood if Edward IV was the natural son of
Richard Duke of York; if Richard III had been told by his mother that
his elder brother was not his father's son, as some sources have
suggested, then Elizabeth, although still his niece, would only have
been of the half blood - but still too close for comfort in the eyes
of the church.
I have always thought that the "Richard-to-marry-Elizabeth" stories
were Tudor propaganda aimed at blackening his name - after all they
proved exceptionally good at doing so after his death, and would have
been doing everything they could to do so in advance of Richmond's
invasion. Everything suggests that Richard was genuinely mourning
Queen Anne and unless his emotions were so badly shaken up by her
death that he wasn't thinking straight, I cannot believe he would have
seriously contemplated marrying his brother's daughter.
Richard G
--- In , A LYON <A.Lyon1@...>
> wrote:
>
> There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth, but
> there was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece
> (and of the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the
> validity of Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
Richard Duke of York; if Richard III had been told by his mother that
his elder brother was not his father's son, as some sources have
suggested, then Elizabeth, although still his niece, would only have
been of the half blood - but still too close for comfort in the eyes
of the church.
I have always thought that the "Richard-to-marry-Elizabeth" stories
were Tudor propaganda aimed at blackening his name - after all they
proved exceptionally good at doing so after his death, and would have
been doing everything they could to do so in advance of Richmond's
invasion. Everything suggests that Richard was genuinely mourning
Queen Anne and unless his emotions were so badly shaken up by her
death that he wasn't thinking straight, I cannot believe he would have
seriously contemplated marrying his brother's daughter.
Richard G
--- In , A LYON <A.Lyon1@...>
> wrote:
>
> There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth, but
> there was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece
> (and of the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the
> validity of Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Re: Richard & Elizabeth (Weir's Pro
2007-03-13 15:01:16
I note your point, but even if Edward were not actually the son of the Duke of York, Elizabeth would still be 'officially' Richard's niece of the whole blood, and the church would base its approach to the granting of a dispensation on the 'official' position. Unless Richard were so enthusiastic about the idea of marrying Elizabeth that he would go to the trouble of obtaining an Act of Parliament bastardising Edward IV, which would certainly not guarantee him a dispensation anyway.
Has anyone any idea how La Weir gets over the awkward issue of the uncle-niece relationship?
Ann
rgcorris <RSG_Corris@...> wrote:
They were only of the whole blood if Edward IV was the natural son of
Richard Duke of York; if Richard III had been told by his mother that
his elder brother was not his father's son, as some sources have
suggested, then Elizabeth, although still his niece, would only have
been of the half blood - but still too close for comfort in the eyes
of the church.
I have always thought that the "Richard-to-marry-Elizabeth" stories
were Tudor propaganda aimed at blackening his name - after all they
proved exceptionally good at doing so after his death, and would have
been doing everything they could to do so in advance of Richmond's
invasion. Everything suggests that Richard was genuinely mourning
Queen Anne and unless his emotions were so badly shaken up by her
death that he wasn't thinking straight, I cannot believe he would have
seriously contemplated marrying his brother's daughter.
Richard G
--- In , A LYON <A.Lyon1@...>
> wrote:
>
> There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth, but
> there was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece
> (and of the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the
> validity of Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
Has anyone any idea how La Weir gets over the awkward issue of the uncle-niece relationship?
Ann
rgcorris <RSG_Corris@...> wrote:
They were only of the whole blood if Edward IV was the natural son of
Richard Duke of York; if Richard III had been told by his mother that
his elder brother was not his father's son, as some sources have
suggested, then Elizabeth, although still his niece, would only have
been of the half blood - but still too close for comfort in the eyes
of the church.
I have always thought that the "Richard-to-marry-Elizabeth" stories
were Tudor propaganda aimed at blackening his name - after all they
proved exceptionally good at doing so after his death, and would have
been doing everything they could to do so in advance of Richmond's
invasion. Everything suggests that Richard was genuinely mourning
Queen Anne and unless his emotions were so badly shaken up by her
death that he wasn't thinking straight, I cannot believe he would have
seriously contemplated marrying his brother's daughter.
Richard G
--- In , A LYON <A.Lyon1@...>
> wrote:
>
> There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth, but
> there was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece
> (and of the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the
> validity of Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Re: Richard & Elizabeth (Weir's Pro
2007-03-13 15:35:03
From what I can see, it doesn't faze Weir at all.
A LYON wrote:
>
> I note your point, but even if Edward were not actually the son of the
> Duke of York, Elizabeth would still be 'officially' Richard's niece of
> the whole blood, and the church would base its approach to the
> granting of a dispensation on the 'official' position. Unless Richard
> were so enthusiastic about the idea of marrying Elizabeth that he
> would go to the trouble of obtaining an Act of Parliament bastardising
> Edward IV, which would certainly not guarantee him a dispensation anyway.
>
> Has anyone any idea how La Weir gets over the awkward issue of the
> uncle-niece relationship?
>
> Ann
>
> rgcorris <RSG_Corris@hotmail. com <mailto:RSG_Corris%40hotmail.com>>
> wrote:
> They were only of the whole blood if Edward IV was the natural son of
> Richard Duke of York; if Richard III had been told by his mother that
> his elder brother was not his father's son, as some sources have
> suggested, then Elizabeth, although still his niece, would only have
> been of the half blood - but still too close for comfort in the eyes
> of the church.
>
> I have always thought that the "Richard-to- marry-Elizabeth" stories
> were Tudor propaganda aimed at blackening his name - after all they
> proved exceptionally good at doing so after his death, and would have
> been doing everything they could to do so in advance of Richmond's
> invasion. Everything suggests that Richard was genuinely mourning
> Queen Anne and unless his emotions were so badly shaken up by her
> death that he wasn't thinking straight, I cannot believe he would have
> seriously contemplated marrying his brother's daughter.
>
> Richard G
>
> --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, A LYON <A.Lyon1@... >
> > wrote:
> >
> > There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth, but
> > there was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece
> > (and of the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the
> > validity of Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
>
>
>
>
A LYON wrote:
>
> I note your point, but even if Edward were not actually the son of the
> Duke of York, Elizabeth would still be 'officially' Richard's niece of
> the whole blood, and the church would base its approach to the
> granting of a dispensation on the 'official' position. Unless Richard
> were so enthusiastic about the idea of marrying Elizabeth that he
> would go to the trouble of obtaining an Act of Parliament bastardising
> Edward IV, which would certainly not guarantee him a dispensation anyway.
>
> Has anyone any idea how La Weir gets over the awkward issue of the
> uncle-niece relationship?
>
> Ann
>
> rgcorris <RSG_Corris@hotmail. com <mailto:RSG_Corris%40hotmail.com>>
> wrote:
> They were only of the whole blood if Edward IV was the natural son of
> Richard Duke of York; if Richard III had been told by his mother that
> his elder brother was not his father's son, as some sources have
> suggested, then Elizabeth, although still his niece, would only have
> been of the half blood - but still too close for comfort in the eyes
> of the church.
>
> I have always thought that the "Richard-to- marry-Elizabeth" stories
> were Tudor propaganda aimed at blackening his name - after all they
> proved exceptionally good at doing so after his death, and would have
> been doing everything they could to do so in advance of Richmond's
> invasion. Everything suggests that Richard was genuinely mourning
> Queen Anne and unless his emotions were so badly shaken up by her
> death that he wasn't thinking straight, I cannot believe he would have
> seriously contemplated marrying his brother's daughter.
>
> Richard G
>
> --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, A LYON <A.Lyon1@... >
> > wrote:
> >
> > There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth, but
> > there was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece
> > (and of the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the
> > validity of Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
>
>
>
>
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Re: Richard & Elizabeth (Weir's Pro
2007-03-13 15:45:21
Weir speculates that Catesby and Ratcliffe spoke against the union
because, if Elizabeth of York had become Richard's queen, she would have
taken out her revenge for the deaths of her brothers on them. It's a
rather bizarre argument.
Bill Barber wrote:
>
> From what I can see, it doesn't faze Weir at all.
>
> A LYON wrote:
> >
> > I note your point, but even if Edward were not actually the son of the
> > Duke of York, Elizabeth would still be 'officially' Richard's niece of
> > the whole blood, and the church would base its approach to the
> > granting of a dispensation on the 'official' position. Unless Richard
> > were so enthusiastic about the idea of marrying Elizabeth that he
> > would go to the trouble of obtaining an Act of Parliament bastardising
> > Edward IV, which would certainly not guarantee him a dispensation
> anyway.
> >
> > Has anyone any idea how La Weir gets over the awkward issue of the
> > uncle-niece relationship?
> >
> > Ann
> >
> > rgcorris <RSG_Corris@hotmail. com <mailto:RSG_Corris%40hotmail.com>>
> > wrote:
> > They were only of the whole blood if Edward IV was the natural son of
> > Richard Duke of York; if Richard III had been told by his mother that
> > his elder brother was not his father's son, as some sources have
> > suggested, then Elizabeth, although still his niece, would only have
> > been of the half blood - but still too close for comfort in the eyes
> > of the church.
> >
> > I have always thought that the "Richard-to- marry-Elizabeth" stories
> > were Tudor propaganda aimed at blackening his name - after all they
> > proved exceptionally good at doing so after his death, and would have
> > been doing everything they could to do so in advance of Richmond's
> > invasion. Everything suggests that Richard was genuinely mourning
> > Queen Anne and unless his emotions were so badly shaken up by her
> > death that he wasn't thinking straight, I cannot believe he would have
> > seriously contemplated marrying his brother's daughter.
> >
> > Richard G
> >
> > --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, A LYON <A.Lyon1@... >
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth, but
> > > there was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece
> > > (and of the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the
> > > validity of Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
because, if Elizabeth of York had become Richard's queen, she would have
taken out her revenge for the deaths of her brothers on them. It's a
rather bizarre argument.
Bill Barber wrote:
>
> From what I can see, it doesn't faze Weir at all.
>
> A LYON wrote:
> >
> > I note your point, but even if Edward were not actually the son of the
> > Duke of York, Elizabeth would still be 'officially' Richard's niece of
> > the whole blood, and the church would base its approach to the
> > granting of a dispensation on the 'official' position. Unless Richard
> > were so enthusiastic about the idea of marrying Elizabeth that he
> > would go to the trouble of obtaining an Act of Parliament bastardising
> > Edward IV, which would certainly not guarantee him a dispensation
> anyway.
> >
> > Has anyone any idea how La Weir gets over the awkward issue of the
> > uncle-niece relationship?
> >
> > Ann
> >
> > rgcorris <RSG_Corris@hotmail. com <mailto:RSG_Corris%40hotmail.com>>
> > wrote:
> > They were only of the whole blood if Edward IV was the natural son of
> > Richard Duke of York; if Richard III had been told by his mother that
> > his elder brother was not his father's son, as some sources have
> > suggested, then Elizabeth, although still his niece, would only have
> > been of the half blood - but still too close for comfort in the eyes
> > of the church.
> >
> > I have always thought that the "Richard-to- marry-Elizabeth" stories
> > were Tudor propaganda aimed at blackening his name - after all they
> > proved exceptionally good at doing so after his death, and would have
> > been doing everything they could to do so in advance of Richmond's
> > invasion. Everything suggests that Richard was genuinely mourning
> > Queen Anne and unless his emotions were so badly shaken up by her
> > death that he wasn't thinking straight, I cannot believe he would have
> > seriously contemplated marrying his brother's daughter.
> >
> > Richard G
> >
> > --- In richardiiisocietyfo rum@yahoogroups. com
> > <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, A LYON <A.Lyon1@... >
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > There might be advantages for Richard in marrying Elizabeth, but
> > > there was also the huge disadvantage that they were uncle and niece
> > > (and of the whole blood at that), and the question mark over the
> > > validity of Edward IV's marriage made no difference to that.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
[Richard III Society Forum] Re: Richard & Elizabeth (Weir's Prose)
2007-03-13 17:43:34
rgcorris wrote:
> I have always thought that the
"Richard-to-marry-Elizabeth" stories
> were Tudor propaganda aimed at blackening his name
- after all they
> proved exceptionally good at doing so after his
death, and would have
> been doing everything they could to do so in
advance of Richmond's
> invasion. Everything suggests that Richard was
genuinely mourning
> Queen Anne and unless his emotions were so badly
shaken up by her
> death that he wasn't thinking straight, I cannot
believe he would have
> seriously contemplated marrying his brother's
daughter.
Agreed. It's also belied by the Portugese marriages
that were being arranged before his death.
Take care,
Kat
> I have always thought that the
"Richard-to-marry-Elizabeth" stories
> were Tudor propaganda aimed at blackening his name
- after all they
> proved exceptionally good at doing so after his
death, and would have
> been doing everything they could to do so in
advance of Richmond's
> invasion. Everything suggests that Richard was
genuinely mourning
> Queen Anne and unless his emotions were so badly
shaken up by her
> death that he wasn't thinking straight, I cannot
believe he would have
> seriously contemplated marrying his brother's
daughter.
Agreed. It's also belied by the Portugese marriages
that were being arranged before his death.
Take care,
Kat
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Weir's Prose
2007-03-13 18:03:18
--- In , Stormysky <stormysky75@...> wrote:
>
>
And I agree, how on earth could Weir
> possibly know this information??? Do her official
> portraits show her to be um, overly endowed?
The famous portrait of her that we all know, which is a copy of a lost original, there is no
definition of her bosom at all. She is in the fashion of the time, a gown lined with fur, that
has been tightly laced. There are no boobies to be seen at all. I fear Wearysome Weir has
shot herself in the foot over this one, managed to make herself look a right plonker
etc.,etc., Come to think of it do you think she ever logs on to this forum??
Eileen
>
> In Sunday's Atlanta Journal/Constitution, there was a
> gag inducing article on Weir's "Debut into historical
> fiction" !!!! The writer said that she had was a well
> respected historian (ha), who had written several
> non-fiction books about British royals, and that her
> new book was a great read, even better than Phillipa
> Gregory's historical novels. Since I like Phillipa
> Gregory's novels, I might overcome my better judgement
> and read this tome for myself. ;-)
>
> Rene'
>
>
>
And I agree, how on earth could Weir
> possibly know this information??? Do her official
> portraits show her to be um, overly endowed?
The famous portrait of her that we all know, which is a copy of a lost original, there is no
definition of her bosom at all. She is in the fashion of the time, a gown lined with fur, that
has been tightly laced. There are no boobies to be seen at all. I fear Wearysome Weir has
shot herself in the foot over this one, managed to make herself look a right plonker
etc.,etc., Come to think of it do you think she ever logs on to this forum??
Eileen
>
> In Sunday's Atlanta Journal/Constitution, there was a
> gag inducing article on Weir's "Debut into historical
> fiction" !!!! The writer said that she had was a well
> respected historian (ha), who had written several
> non-fiction books about British royals, and that her
> new book was a great read, even better than Phillipa
> Gregory's historical novels. Since I like Phillipa
> Gregory's novels, I might overcome my better judgement
> and read this tome for myself. ;-)
>
> Rene'
>
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Weir's Prose
2007-03-13 18:19:42
Again, the only mention of her endowments is from a letter written a one
Portuguese ambassador, but Weir manages to get a chapter out of it.
eileen wrote:
>
> --- In
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Stormysky
> <stormysky75@...> wrote:
> >
> >
> And I agree, how on earth could Weir
> > possibly know this information??? Do her official
> > portraits show her to be um, overly endowed?
>
> The famous portrait of her that we all know, which is a copy of a lost
> original, there is no
> definition of her bosom at all. She is in the fashion of the time, a
> gown lined with fur, that
> has been tightly laced. There are no boobies to be seen at all. I fear
> Wearysome Weir has
> shot herself in the foot over this one, managed to make herself look a
> right plonker
> etc.,etc., Come to think of it do you think she ever logs on to this
> forum??
>
> Eileen
>
> >
> > In Sunday's Atlanta Journal/Constitution, there was a
> > gag inducing article on Weir's "Debut into historical
> > fiction" !!!! The writer said that she had was a well
> > respected historian (ha), who had written several
> > non-fiction books about British royals, and that her
> > new book was a great read, even better than Phillipa
> > Gregory's historical novels. Since I like Phillipa
> > Gregory's novels, I might overcome my better judgement
> > and read this tome for myself. ;-)
> >
> > Rene'
> >
>
>
Portuguese ambassador, but Weir manages to get a chapter out of it.
eileen wrote:
>
> --- In
> <mailto:%40yahoogroups.com>, Stormysky
> <stormysky75@...> wrote:
> >
> >
> And I agree, how on earth could Weir
> > possibly know this information??? Do her official
> > portraits show her to be um, overly endowed?
>
> The famous portrait of her that we all know, which is a copy of a lost
> original, there is no
> definition of her bosom at all. She is in the fashion of the time, a
> gown lined with fur, that
> has been tightly laced. There are no boobies to be seen at all. I fear
> Wearysome Weir has
> shot herself in the foot over this one, managed to make herself look a
> right plonker
> etc.,etc., Come to think of it do you think she ever logs on to this
> forum??
>
> Eileen
>
> >
> > In Sunday's Atlanta Journal/Constitution, there was a
> > gag inducing article on Weir's "Debut into historical
> > fiction" !!!! The writer said that she had was a well
> > respected historian (ha), who had written several
> > non-fiction books about British royals, and that her
> > new book was a great read, even better than Phillipa
> > Gregory's historical novels. Since I like Phillipa
> > Gregory's novels, I might overcome my better judgement
> > and read this tome for myself. ;-)
> >
> > Rene'
> >
>
>
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Weir's Prose
2007-03-13 21:47:17
hmm, well if Ms. Weir does log into this site, it may
be a bit of a downer for her. However, she has the
last laugh, all the way to the bank!
Rene'
be a bit of a downer for her. However, she has the
last laugh, all the way to the bank!
Rene'
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Weir's Prose
2007-03-13 22:44:06
I'm sure she does. I'm still waiting for the hardcover of her book on
Isabella to go remaindered. I'll buy it and let you know how that
particular queen stacked up, as it were.
Stormysky wrote:
>
> hmm, well if Ms. Weir does log into this site, it may
> be a bit of a downer for her. However, she has the
> last laugh, all the way to the bank!
> Rene'
>
>
Isabella to go remaindered. I'll buy it and let you know how that
particular queen stacked up, as it were.
Stormysky wrote:
>
> hmm, well if Ms. Weir does log into this site, it may
> be a bit of a downer for her. However, she has the
> last laugh, all the way to the bank!
> Rene'
>
>
Re: [Richard III Society Forum] Weir's Prose
2007-03-14 02:56:40
I did get the book from the library.
I didn't find any mention of how Isabella was 'stacked' but Weir did say she was "highly sexed"!
You might understand now why I couldn't finish the book.
Helen
Bill Barber <bbarber@...> wrote:
I'm sure she does. I'm still waiting for the hardcover of her book on
Isabella to go remaindered. I'll buy it and let you know how that
particular queen stacked up, as it were.
Stormysky wrote:
>
> hmm, well if Ms. Weir does log into this site, it may
> be a bit of a downer for her. However, she has the
> last laugh, all the way to the bank!
> Rene'
>
>
Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com
I didn't find any mention of how Isabella was 'stacked' but Weir did say she was "highly sexed"!
You might understand now why I couldn't finish the book.
Helen
Bill Barber <bbarber@...> wrote:
I'm sure she does. I'm still waiting for the hardcover of her book on
Isabella to go remaindered. I'll buy it and let you know how that
particular queen stacked up, as it were.
Stormysky wrote:
>
> hmm, well if Ms. Weir does log into this site, it may
> be a bit of a downer for her. However, she has the
> last laugh, all the way to the bank!
> Rene'
>
>
Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com
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